Please make another UT

[Bl!tz~]

agree with gargorias about the bots, not that hard to keep bots on a "human" level as they nicely succeded to do so in first versions
sly is right about the different periods (99 to 2004 to 2008...) but again it just looks like a sabotage to replace something nice by something worst/wrong/unbalanced....lol

[azurescorch]

I also agree with gargorias about fixing bots (not sure about making them like in ut99 but still). At the moment they don't act human at all. They're extremely unintelligent. They ditch vehicles in vehicle game types without proper cause. Their aim is terrible with projectiles but stupidly accurate with hitscan. They run for a powerup regardless of what you're doing, ie standing next to it with bio ready (using methods like this is how I've won duals with godlike bots).

Playing against a godlike bot can be simulated by giving a complete FPS novice a hack kit. They both play exactly the same.

[Sly.]

Yep, godlike bots in UT3 are a pain and truly no fun. If I ever play offline I play on masterful since they (obviously) even cheat on inhuman! I can't recall being able to turn the barrel of the Goliath turret faster than the turret itself but a bot did so that he shot through the turret before it even rotated to your direction -as if the turret didn't have a collision and the barrel moved through it to be able to hit you! Seriously, I had this happen!
Definitely, no fun!

In UT (godlike) and Unreal (masterful being the highest possible setting) they behave like humans and I rarely see them "cheat" (like shooting in 90°, just like the UT3 bots do) and it is really fun playing against them. It's a challange and you don't get pwned over and over by some strange actions. Their movement and aim gets better though and if you had dodge behaviour enabled they just dodged into your direction with the Flak Cannon in their hands, stinger'd you to death or made you kiss their Pulse Gun beam and after a short moment you were dead. In UT2004 it changed a little bit but it is still acceptable. I caught them "cheating" much more often than in UT99 and Unreal 1 but it's not nearly as bad as in UT3 and it still makes fun and is a nice challange.

To keep it short: UT3's bots cheat and have no real skill like in the forerunners of the game!

[HoLoPo1nT]

Geez, it'd be nice if they also fix the ability for players to utilize bot AI via hacks.

Rampant, marginally policed cheating will always kill a games potential for widespread popularity and UT seems to be a magnet for unethical 'mods'.

[azurescorch]

Geez, it'd be nice if they also fix the ability for players to utilize bot AI via hacks.

Rampant, marginally policed cheating will always kill a games potential for widespread popularity and UT seems to be a magnet for unethical 'mods'.

Never saw much hacking in UT3 myself, then again I've always played on servers where the admins are fairly easy to reach, either in game, steam, or over irc.

tbh though I've seen server empty in other games over "hacking" when no hacks are taking place..

[Gameslaya]

I don't really have complaints with the bots on Deathmatch mode. I've just come to accept that Godlike means you will be playing against aimbots. (Seriously, record a demo, spectate a bot, and type behindview 0. It's terrifying! )

But Warfare/VCTF mode online? Any time a bot grabs the orb or a key vehicle, it's the same thing as sabotage. Sure, the bots are fine for offline play or multiplayer with noobs, but on Epic's Official Warfare server, oh man. Even if you tell the bot to drop the orb, you just lost about five seconds towards a node cap, which can literally cause a game loss if you are facing a decent team.

[Sly.]

tbh though I've seen server empty in other games over "hacking" when no hacks are taking place..

Napalm32nd seems to be lying
But honestly I've seen almost nobody hacking in UT3 either. Just once where it was really obvious but the admins took care of that once they found out.

However, the bots do cheat lol

[Nono]

There isn't much cheating in UT3, noticed a couple of turret bot users and that's about it.

But there aren't many playing, so maybe it's just lack of incentive for the people who develop exploits and cheats, idk. UT04 Ons demo servers suffered aimbot problems , still do in fact , even today. I guess that was one of their considerations in not having 'much needed' War demo servers.

[HoLoPo1nT]

When UT3 first launched there was a rash of aimbots and hacks on the servers I played on as scripters re-tooled their hack packages for the new engine.

It's good to know that much of that has disappeared but I tend to side with the idea that it's due to the games anemic population as opposed to anything actually being done on a widespread basis to deal with that problem.

I still see it almost daily in UT2k4. Noobs log in with aimbots and reveal themselves as cheaters within minutes. Almost any avid, veteran player will be able to detect such players from the 'feel' of combat with them. From that point it's easy to drop to spec. and watch a player for the tell-tales.

It should be a developers priority in an arena fps to ensure as much as possible that server admins are empowered with the tools they need to deal with code abuses.

[Sly.]

I still see it almost daily in UT2k4. Noobs log in with aimbots and reveal themselves as cheaters within minutes. Almost any avid, veteran player will be able to detect such players from the 'feel' of combat with them. From that point it's easy to drop to spec. and watch a player for the tell-tales.

That's what it is useful to play on Anti-TCC servers since their bots will be detected within a few seconds and they will be kicked.

However, I've never seen something like that for UT3. If this game would become popular from one day to another there would be plenty of cheaters again since there is nothing that controls them apart from the admins on a server - and I doubt that they can tell that they cheat after the first 30 seconds when those cheaters logged in.

[HoLoPo1nT]

That's what it is useful to play on Anti-TCC servers since their bots will be detected within a few seconds and they will be kicked.

However, I've never seen something like that for UT3. If this game would become popular from one day to another there would be plenty of cheaters again since there is nothing that controls them apart from the admins on a server - and I doubt that they can tell that they cheat after the first 30 seconds when those cheaters logged in.

Heh, I would LOVE to find a UT2k4 server with latest UTComp and AntiTCC with a ping under 80 and all those great maps that AREN'T FaceClassic. Unfortunately the only server I can play reasonably competitively on from the pacific northwest is a Face only demo server (I'm a CTF fan btw).

I'm pretty sure there are versions of UTComp and AntiTCC for UT3.

[Sly.]

Yeah, in this case we EU citizens seem to be very lucky :/

[Bl!tz~]

When UT3 first launched there was a rash of aimbots and hacks on the servers I played on as scripters re-tooled their hack packages for the new engine.

It's good to know that much of that has disappeared but I tend to side with the idea that it's due to the games anemic population as opposed to anything actually being done on a widespread basis to deal with that problem.

I still see it almost daily in UT2k4. Noobs log in with aimbots and reveal themselves as cheaters within minutes. Almost any avid, veteran player will be able to detect such players from the 'feel' of combat with them. From that point it's easy to drop to spec. and watch a player for the tell-tales.

It should be a developers priority in an arena fps to ensure as much as possible that server admins are empowered with the tools they need to deal with code abuses.

100 % agree with all that
lil observation though,back in 2008 if u was playing on a low end mashine vs someone on a brand new rig the "rendering" difference was so huge that it was sometime driving you to think that u was playin vs an aimbot...
the game is absolutly unplayable on some mashine and when u upgrade your rig u discover you new skill and new aim...
having a **** connection vs a top notch cabled one can drive to the same feelings....+.+

[LLonewolf]

When UT3 first launched there was a rash of aimbots and hacks on the servers I played on as scripters re-tooled their hack packages for the new engine.

It's good to know that much of that has disappeared but I tend to side with the idea that it's due to the games anemic population as opposed to anything actually being done on a widespread basis to deal with that problem.

I still see it almost daily in UT2k4. Noobs log in with aimbots and reveal themselves as cheaters within minutes. Almost any avid, veteran player will be able to detect such players from the 'feel' of combat with them. From that point it's easy to drop to spec. and watch a player for the tell-tales.

It should be a developers priority in an arena fps to ensure as much as possible that server admins are empowered with the tools they need to deal with code abuses.

Feel free to devellop a new basic server side tool if u feel in the mood for ...i now i dream actually i wanted to just rebound on your message.

The problem is basically the same in 2k4 heh, for all stupid/newbies cheaters, it's not a problem at all. They are easily spotable and get kick quite fast. Where it's more annoying than in 2k4, it's because in ut3, u need an admin if u don't have utcomp for vote kick and with antitcc it's kick+ban iirc.
But for "real" cheaters, don't dream..... it's been a looooooooooong time, they:
1) learn to hide their hack,
2) was careful to order a hack non detectable.
And they are the real problem, not the guy that thinks making monster kill in insta is co0l :| .

ps: holopo1nt, i didn't read where u are located, but try bencezk ctf server (check related topic), it's .de located and everyone have good and stable ping even with 10 ppl in firing everywhere. U will find some good ppl and some less, some german and some, belarus, russian, israelian etc, if u aren't bother too much to play with super ping (i guess), try it between 18-21h cet. it's when, most of the time, we are in.

[HoLoPo1nT]

Feel free to devellop a new basic server side tool if u feel in the mood for ...i now i dream actually i wanted to just rebound on your message.

The problem is basically the same in 2k4 heh, for all stupid/newbies cheaters, it's not a problem at all. They are easily spotable and get kick quite fast. Where it's more annoying than in 2k4, it's because in ut3, u need an admin if u don't have utcomp for vote kick and with antitcc it's kick+ban iirc.
But for "real" cheaters, don't dream..... it's been a looooooooooong time, they:
1) learn to hide their hack,
2) was careful to order a hack non detectable.
And they are the real problem, not the guy that thinks making monster kill in insta is co0l :| .

ps: holopo1nt, i didn't read where u are located, but try bencezk ctf server (check related topic), it's .de located and everyone have good and stable ping even with 10 ppl in firing everywhere. U will find some good ppl and some less, some german and some, belarus, russian, israelian etc, if u aren't bother too much to play with super ping (i guess), try it between 18-21h cet. it's when, most of the time, we are in.

Honestly, I don't feel that cheat prevention/detection/removal should be a user modded utility. It should be a server-side check or series of checks that can be toggled by admins to either allow or disallow cheats but it should be from the developer and imbedded in the server code...and patched as needed.

And you are right..the real culprits are those who have made a several year long campaign of public denial to try to convince people they are not cheating while being very sly with those cheats. In most cases, the natural players know who they are but server admins rarely take appropriate action and they always tend to slither back in.

Anyhow, I think one of the major flaws with the UE is it's hackablity. You see it in MMO's based on the engine and in the UT series and I'm not sure about other MP games based on UE but this should definitely be a concern for the developers to help admins police, not the players.