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For all the old-time VCTF mappers

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    For all the old-time VCTF mappers

    *Thanks to captain Snarf for showing me how easy it is to get back up to speed modding vehicles in UT3*


    Do you remember how during the demo there were loads of us who hated the fact that a flag-runner could no longer jump into a handy ground-vehicle?

    At the time I supposed that it was merely a case of setting bCanCarryFlag == True, in the individual vehicles' default properties - I didn't think it would be that simple, but it is!

    [shot]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v108/BigJim/OMG-FlagInnaScorpion.jpg[/shot]

    Hooray - now anyone who wants to build more "classic" VCTF map styles can do so so. Merely subclass your Scorp/Bender/Goli/Pally/etc... and set the relevant boolean.

    Now, of course it might also be a good idea to remove the Scorp's booster function (or not, depending on your map style), but hell, now that we know it's possible without having to re-code reams & reams, then it should open up a bunch of new possibilities.


    Once I've got a shader model-3 card that lets me run the Ed without ock-ups, my first map will probably be a vctf map designed (properly designed) to allow foot cappers to drive in ground vehicles.
    *This* is what I've been waiting for!

    #2
    When i get my new card ill try to remake some of the maps.

    Comment


      #3
      That's a good tip, thanks! Certainly will be getting there eventually with Chaos.

      Have you done any kind of further playtesting, to see if it works well or is riddled with bugs?

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by R.Flagg View Post

        Have you done any kind of further playtesting, to see if it works well or is riddled with bugs?
        I haven't server tested it yet, but I assume the netcode is solid. Afterall, the hoverboard is a vehicle as far as the code is concerned, so I can't imagine that there are any real differences that would break anything.

        Plus, I didn't even have to tweak the flag position!
        That indicates to me one of two things;

        1) The Scorp was coded to allow vehicles to carry the flag and it was a later design decision to disallow vehicles to carry the flag, or;
        2) It was coded that way on purpose, but disabled in the stock game to make it easier for modders to include vehicle-runs later on.

        Either way suits me fine!
        After all, if the coders had explicitly decided right from the beginning that no vehicle could ever carry a flag, they wouldn't have even bothered tweaking the attachment position/angle so that it looks good.


        Will try it out with the Bender/Goli/Spama/Pally next week, when I've got my hands on a shader model 3 card (atm I'm running an x700 which doesn't play nice with the Editor..).

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by BigJim View Post
          *Thanks to captain Snarf for showing me how easy it is to get back up to speed modding vehicles in UT3*


          Do you remember how during the demo there were loads of us who hated the fact that a flag-runner could no longer jump into a handy ground-vehicle?

          At the time I supposed that it was merely a case of setting bCanCarryFlag == True, in the individual vehicles' default properties - I didn't think it would be that simple, but it is!

          [shot]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v108/BigJim/OMG-FlagInnaScorpion.jpg[/shot]

          Hooray - now anyone who wants to build more "classic" VCTF map styles can do so so. Merely subclass your Scorp/Bender/Goli/Pally/etc... and set the relevant boolean.

          Now, of course it might also be a good idea to remove the Scorp's booster function (or not, depending on your map style), but hell, now that we know it's possible without having to re-code reams & reams, then it should open up a bunch of new possibilities.


          Once I've got a shader model-3 card that lets me run the Ed without ock-ups, my first map will probably be a vctf map designed (properly designed) to allow foot cappers to drive in ground vehicles.
          *This* is what I've been waiting for!

          Nice!!! You coming from UT2K4? Nice!!!

          Comment


            #6
            Anyone know if there's a mutator that does this? That way we can play the default maps with vehicle caps as well?

            Comment


              #7
              That's great! But, unless it's made official by Epic, I doubt it'll catch on very well. Great effort though

              Comment


                #8
                Personally I don't intend to cretae a mutator for it, although that would be entirely possible.

                What I do plan though is to use this concept within my own vctf maps - that way I can be sure that the map is designed so such play won't hurt the game.

                For example - I don't think that Suspense would play very well if every-****** was trying to Scorpion-boost back home with the flag - yawn.


                However, Kargo might benefit from it - I mean, it's tricky to line up that Scorp-jump when you're under pressure and fire, and it would make it doubly-important to control that center Goli or disable it if the enemy control it.

                Plus, it would give an incentive for your team to put active players on patrol around the midfield to intercept any vehicles that manage to break your defence, and clever use of the slow-field would stop any smartarse max-maxxer in his tracks (literally ).

                Just once example, and like I say, in the case of the Scorpion it might need the booster to be removed, but we shouldn't get hung-up on the Scorp.
                When cappers were prevented from getting in vehicles it removed a whole aspect of VCTF gameplay.

                The teamwork that comes from multi-player bender runs, or even the escape artist - how often did you jump into a damaged vehicle that the enemy had left in their own base for the extra 50 or 60 armour it had left, just to get out of the enemy fire for a few extra seconds?
                It wasn't all about mad-cap vehicle runs, it was about having the freedom to use whatever was in the map to escape your pursuers.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Plus what's stopping a defender from stealing the free Scorpion while the capper is grabbing the flag and slaying him with it?

                  Comment


                    #10
                    For example - I don't think that Suspense would play very well if every-****** was trying to Scorpion-boost back home with the flag

                    R U CRA_Z?

                    Suspense is perfect for this. It reminds me "Alleys" In utk4 when in the middle of the heat when it looked that none could penetrate enemy flag I just grabbed the Buggy and BAM! Captured the enemy Flag! Im fine with it on any map with or with out Boost

                    Think about it...

                    Comment


                      #11
                      yes nice work!
                      but, the cars are going fast, so mabey make them more slowly?
                      also it would be nice the mantaruns come back

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Thanx Jim! this is exatcly what i needed!

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Honestly I'd rather have the boost function than to be able to carry a flag in it.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by TDA NESS View Post
                            Honestly I'd rather have the boost function than to be able to carry a flag in it.
                            Cool - that's why it's useful that you can code up any kind of behaviour you want.
                            All I wanted to do was point out a single Boolean that controls behaviour that I (and others) thought was no longer possible.

                            To me, the game just feel "unnatural" that I can be legging it out of the enemy base with like 5HP left, have to run past that handy Bender just sitting there, but the 3 or 4 guys behind me can jump in it and shombo me to death, instantly, for just one example..


                            The Scorpion is a rather special case because of it's speed-boost, which is why I didn't want to get too hung-up over that one particular vehicle.
                            For sure, we can all probably think of a few examples where the balance (as in the defensive/offensive balance, not team-balance) of a map might be hurt or hindered by speedy-Scorps, but then again the same could be said for anything that exists in the game - ruling out *anything* just because of one or two examples where it wouldn't work well would be silly - far better to just not include those things in maps where it would be unsuitable.

                            I'm all for mappers having as much control over the gameplay in thier own maps as possible.


                            @Zim: NP maite, I'm sure you or someone else would have stumbled upon this sooner or later, after all, it's simply a case of setting one Boolean var to true - UT2K4 used exactly the same mechanism to prevent say, Mantas & Raptors from taking the flag so I can't exactly say it was an inspired guess on my part..

                            @Andy: Cool mate - if you reckon you could make Suspense play better then you know what to do!
                            Think of how many "LE" or "No-Manta" editions of maps there were for 2K4 vctf - lots of players & servers had preferences over how they liked their maps, and sometimes a simple modification like replacing one vehicle with another could make the difference from a map getting no play to loads of play.


                            Now, far be it for me to try & tell anyone what to do, I just wanted to pint out that a ridiculously simple modification like this could have major changes upon gameplay, and generally (imho) for the better.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              For example - I don't think that Suspense would play very well if every-****** was trying to Scorpion-boost back home with the flag

                              You are just thinking on that, we dont know for sure how it will play but belive me I have an eye for this things and I bet you that it will play fine(Suspense+Able to capture flag on buggys,tanks,benders) There are plenty of AVRiL players to make up for it(it will be balanced out of the box) IM SPEAKING ON SUSPENSE ONLY at the moment.

                              "if you reckon you could make Suspense play better then you know what to do!"
                              It is not going to play better because if I install/activate that "mod" It will be better because I will be playing on it and having that same feeling when in the middle of a war(In alley map) I grabbed the buggy and said to mayself... "meh, Im going in, I own this,Im the boss here" "whats the worst that can happend?" and returned to my base sound and safe and scoring 1 for my team... ahhhh utk4... the memories...
                              : )) think about it,again!

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