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Defence vs. Camping

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    Defence vs. Camping

    Today someone on our team parked the Goliath on the enemy prime node in Downtown and did an admirable job of keeping it safe until the enemy core was destroyed. Someone didn't like this though, and insisted that such tactics should be considered camping, not defending.

    What do you think? If a tactic works, is it automatically okay, or should some things be avoided because they are lame (ignoring map bug exploits and stuff like that)?

    #2
    Fair does not necessarily mean fun, however.

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      #3
      Originally posted by Mort_Q View Post
      Fair does not necessarily mean fun, however.
      Nail, head.

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        #4
        Protecting a node sounds fine. What's annoying is when people sit in mid-field on a vCTF map.

        If you're playing with people you know on TS or Vent though it's usually pretty easy to counter, which would also be the case if the VOIP wasn't so quiet and people knew about it (press B for talk).

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          #5
          There are nearly always counters to tactics. If there aren't, then it's unfair, and most likely design flaw. You can't blame opportunists for exploiting it.

          Scrubs will complain about anything though. They just want the game changed to accommodate them, rather than adapt to it.

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            #6
            I had a similar problem. I was on a losing team, so i thought i would be sneaky & use the nightshades spiderminds in the opposing teams base.

            We started to make a comeback, but i was told "Noob, stop camping" etc either they got annoyed they kept getting killed or the miracle of a come back & win

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              #7
              It is completely dependent on the gametype and when/where you are camping.

              Protecting a friendly node by parking a tank on the hill above it is 100% OK when it comes to WAR. Turning the tank around and camping the enemy's base (while their core is still locked), is just plain annoying. However, using that same tactic in a DM game (ie, hiding on an elevated ledge with your shock rifle out) is just stupid.

              CTF gets a little more complicated: defending the flag is fine, camping the midground is might be. Camping the enemy's spawns is not.

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                #8
                All I play is defence always have and always will. Some times I camp the flag. If some people have a problem with that Well...Tough S!!!. Its called defence anyway you call it. You want to call it camping fine. But the bottom line is Its called "Capture The Flag" and Ill use any means available me to keep anyone for getting the flag. Cant hardly wait to get a Deployable Spider Mines Like UT2004. ( I need a mutator ASAP!!!! hehehee ) You can bet your *** Ill deploy those suckers at Strategic points near the flag!

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                  #9
                  Map bugs should be avoided (like traveling outside the "world" by a bsp or blocking glitch). Map errors (like asymmetry) are fair game, since they're just the result of sloppiness, and not computer errors.

                  Other than that, every tactic is fair game. Spawn camping, regular camping, hiding in shadows, brutal spammage... it's all fair. When unwritten rules get official sanction, we get Assault'04: Game on Rails. No alternate routes. Tight constrains on where you can go, and where you can't based on team affiliation, no shadows, and so on.

                  I say, if one person can pin down your entire team by using a strategy you can't counter, you deserve to lose, bitter as it may be.

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                    #10
                    Lame tactics on publics deserves a ban imo. Public servers are there for people to have fun, and if someone is taking the fun away for others it's bye bye. Have kicked tons of lamers of servers over the years, the most amusing kind is the one that starts crying and tries to argue lol.

                    In leagues and cups on the other hand everything not explicitly stated in the rules is allowed.

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                      #11
                      Well, considering that getting the goliath up there was probably a bit of work and given that there is a deemer in the map that could take it out should everything else fail (exit base to the south, go all the way around, camp for deemer - do it with several people to increase survival chances), I'd say it's fair.

                      Another approach would be to somehow make your way to the back entrance of the prime node building and get the tank from behind. If enough people do it the tank would be unable to keep up with the attackers both from the front and the back.

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                        #12
                        I can never resist to get the Goliath up to the Air Node on Islander, to the left Raptor's spawn point. :P Prevents the whole opposing team from leaving their base, gets you a massacre in 1 minute and lots of curses as well.

                        Still it's just bad map design and often easily exploitable. There are many imbalanced and unfair tank spots in WAR, I won't give all the other ones away though. ;P

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                          #13
                          Everything in the map is fair game to use, as long as it's not a glitch or other unintended side-effect.

                          Mappers who put Spider Mine Layers in regular lockers, though? Yeah, they should be drawn and quartered.

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                            #14
                            Originally posted by LêøÑ¡dås View Post
                            I can never resist to get the Goliath up to the Air Node on Islander, to the left Raptor's spawn point. :P Prevents the whole opposing team from leaving their base, gets you a massacre in 1 minute and lots of curses as well.
                            The only issue I have with this is recognizing the tactic because I haven't been on the receving end many times yet.

                            But it's defeatable once you understand what happens: quickly grab the avril in between two goliath rounds, use the leftmost base exit, go at the bottom of the stair that leads to the shaped charge then play hide and seek to launch the avrils at the tank.

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                              #15
                              Originally posted by Curiosity View Post
                              The only issue I have with this is recognizing the tactic because I haven't been on the receving end many times yet.

                              But it's defeatable once you understand what happens: quickly grab the avril in between two goliath rounds, use the leftmost base exit, go at the bottom of the stair that leads to the shaped charge then play hide and seek to launch the avrils at the tank.
                              Exactly. It's quite odd that most people don't even bother to destroy the tank up there, although they get killed over and over again when they step out of the base (on the same path all the time ;p). Another tactic is to sneak around the map and get to the jumppad that leads to the air node and flak the tank, as it's hard to keep an eye on what happens behind you (restriced cam view...).

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