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Skarj Out of UT 3?

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    #31
    Originally posted by Malakai View Post
    Actually, the U2 Skaarj do react to certain weapons. If you start shooting them with the Assault Rifle, they start deflecting the shots with their blades. And when you had to reload, they'd get close and slash you to hell.
    That's reactive. It's in response to being shot repeatedly. What I'm talking about is: if you pull out the ASMD on a skaarj, and point it at him, he'll move before you fire, and attempt to close the gap, the lessent he power of the hitscan weapon. If you then pull out the Flak, he'll back away.
    If the U2 Skaarj put up their claws when I pulled the CAR out, instead of after a second or two of fire, that'd be something else.

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      #32
      The Unreal 2 Skaarj dodged shots and generally moved faster then the player could, they moved almost exactly the same way the original Skaarj moved, despite the new added deflection ability they were given in U2.

      The unreal 2 Skaarj did move slower then the original Skaarj, but then again you moved slower in U2 also then in the original unreal. At anyrate, the Skaarj in U2 move faster then the player in both games and were pretty equivalent in how tough they were from both games.

      To me the Skaarj in U2 give the best example of how the original skaarj are with better graphics. The Skaarj from UT1, UT2004, and UC2 were much to human like in their art style.

      Comment


        #33
        Originally posted by Kronos View Post
        The Unreal 2 Skaarj dodged shots and generally moved faster then the player could, they moved almost exactly the same way the original Skaarj moved, despite the new added deflection ability they were given in U2.

        The unreal 2 Skaarj did move slower then the original Skaarj, but then again you moved slower in U2 also then in the original unreal. At anyrate, the Skaarj in U2 move faster then the player in both games and were pretty equivalent in how tough they were from both games.

        To me the Skaarj in U2 give the best example of how the original skaarj are with better graphics. The Skaarj from UT1, UT2004, and UC2 were much to human like in their art style.
        They just came accross as giant mindless brutes. Their visual design is significantly more dumpy and bulky, and their vocalizations are more like mindless roars instead of coherent language. Another big part of it is their stance. The originals hold themselves as competant, intelligent fighters, the U2 ones just run in like idiots with their arms spread like they're going to give you a hug, and their standing pose (like when recovering from a leap) just has them drop their arms to the side, instead of going to an intelligent-looking fighting stance. Also, their dodging nad blocking is still mostly reactive, instead of proactive, and they don't even begin to respond to what weapon I've got out.
        Take a good look at Garek and compare him to a Skaarj Trooper. The body shape is almost exactly the same.

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          #34
          Garek is nothing more then just a modified version of Torgr, and Torgr looks nothing like the original skaarj. The Unreal 2 skaarj were almost nearly just as big and slow as the ones in UC2, and on top of that the U2 ones looked more related to the original in terms of art style.
          Here are some things U2 Skaarj have in common with the original.

          1.Both naked

          2.Both have almost if not complete identical face structures(somthing no other skaarj has)

          3.While the U2 Skaarj appear larger, their layout of their body remains the same

          4.The skaarj in the original roared just as mindless as the ones in U2

          5. All skaarj that i've seen from the original to U2 to UT2004 don't have hair, they have tentacles made of their own flesh and blood(It confused me in UC2 to see skaarj with actual hair to be rapped up in a ponytail)

          Most of your complaints about the U2 skaarj seem more driven towards their additude then there appearance.

          Comment


            #35
            Originally posted by Hedge-o-Matic View Post
            I just think that to make Skarrj balanced with the others, you've got to take out basically everything that makes them Skarrj. This lessens their impact, and makes them a lot less cool in the player's minds. Better to be absent and longed for, than present and forgettable.

            that's a v good point.

            as for the mini-gun, I thought they took it out because the hit-scan was so annoying in AS/ONS? I'm suprised they did it all just for a new image.

            Comment


              #36
              Originally posted by Kronos View Post
              Garek is nothing more then just a modified version of Torgr, and Torgr looks nothing like the original skaarj.
              I said Garek, notTorgr. Besides, look at the general form and the body shape and compare it to the Skaarj Trooper.

              The Unreal 2 skaarj were almost nearly just as big and slow as the ones in UC2, and on top of that the U2 ones looked more related to the original in terms of art style.
              Here are some things U2 Skaarj have in common with the original.

              1.Both naked
              Only 1 type of Skaarj in Unreal had no armor at all. Armor-clad Skaarj are more related to Unreal than naked ones.


              2.Both have almost if not complete identical face structures(somthing no other skaarj has)
              Their face structure, however, is almost nothing like the original Skaarj. The original have almost insect-like mouths (small, and with two down-ward pointing fangs that resemble those of a spider, which links them to their insect-like pupae form,) and slim faces, the U2 Skaarj look like wild boars, with giant mouths and sever upward pointing tusks, giving them an underbite that traditionally is used in design to show animalistic, or simply unintelligent character. Characters with underbites ususally look unintelligent, that's why you give them an underbite. Also, I should link you to shots of one of the Skaarj that Legend didn't have time to put in, which has a distincly different facial design.
              Besides, I wouldn't call this an essential design element, I'd just call it being lazy. The closer Epic comes to making specific Skaarj characters, the more each Skaarj is differentiated. This tells me that the Skaarj are supposed to have unique looks from one-another, and are not supposed to be unnatural clones of each other.

              3.While the U2 Skaarj appear larger, their layout of their body remains the same
              No. It doesn't. Unreal 2 Skaarj are stockier and more bulky, not at all designed as competent warriors and more as weight-lifting brutes. They're top-heavy, their muscles are not as well defined, making them appear biker-big instead of lean and toned.
              It's an essential design element that eliminates the essential grace that they once had. The Skaarj are supposed to be sleek and efficient, not heavy and bulky with random spikes and blades and **** sticking every which way out of their armor.
              Besides, in this one and the first, you are completely ignoring two-thirds of the Skaarj in U2. The U2 Medium class armor looks llike generic UT1 body armor and thigh pads with spikes stuck on, and don't even get me started on the heavy (which I consider to be an f'ing insult to what the Skaarj originally were.) The original Skaarj armor was dark and sleek, with no random protrusions for the Skaarj to stick and jab himself on in the middle of combat. It's the armor of a sensible warrior, not a stupid bloodthirsty brute.

              4.The skaarj in the original roared just as mindless as the ones in U2
              No. They. F'ing. Didn't. U1 Skaarj had swift, efficient phrases with clearly defined words, or at least sound segments. U-Gat-cha, or however you say it. It comes off clean and pronounced. You can time it to the Hybrid's chest-beating animation, it's that clear. The U2 Skaarj language comes off slurred and lazy.

              5. All skaarj that i've seen from the original to U2 to UT2004 don't have hair, they have tentacles made of their own flesh and blood(It confused me in UC2 to see skaarj with actual hair to be rapped up in a ponytail)
              The tentacles that the 2k4 Skaarj have are ridiculous, and the farthest thing from either the U1 Skaarj or anyone else. ALSO, as you can see if you'd actually look, the U2 Skaarj have finer, hair-like dreds as well. It's tied into braids of sorts through little diamond-shaped ornaments, but the detail clearly shows strands and a hair-like texture. I can link screenshots if you like.

              Most of your complaints about the U2 skaarj seem more driven towards their additude then there appearance.
              It's a combination of everything, and it all paints them as brutes. Your observations weren't close enough. It's a combination of sound, animation, and visual design as well as AI and behavior.

              Garek has a sleeker armor design. It still has spiky portions and such, but they flow with the armor and don't look like they'd get in the way (or skewer him in the top of the head if he moves is arms up over half-way.) His body shape is almost identical to a Skaarj Trooper's. His tail is the same as a Skaarj Trooper's. Torgr has a similar spiked-back, triangular helmet shape as a Trooper. The belt-mounted thigh-pad design is back from U1 (admittedly a predominantly Warrior feature,) as are the full-foot boots, for a Trooper. The chest armor is minimalist while still being present, and doesn't look like it will get in the way or bog the wearer down too much.

              The Skaarj need to be intelligent, efficient, sleek warriors, not rabid boars, a description, by the way, once used by Epic to describe the U2 design, when explaining the difference from U2 to 2k4.
              ---------------------------

              Originally posted by Destini View Post
              that's a v good point.

              as for the mini-gun, I thought they took it out because the hit-scan was so annoying in AS/ONS? I'm suprised they did it all just for a new image.
              I definitely agree on the Skaarj point there, as well, unless they open it up UC2 style with class differences and such. The problem could be easily avoided via the Skaarj Hybrids, but no-one seems to like them.

              The secondary on the Stinger is entirely different. It fires some-what slow-moving projectiles that can pin bodies to walls, so it wasn't just a new look.

              Comment


                #37
                Despite all your arguments about what does/doesn't make a skaarj, the skaarj in Unreal2 had the biggest impact on me, and i gained a healthy respect for them when playing that game! They were almost exactly what i felt the Skaarj needed to be; powerful, cunning, fast and brutal killing machines - with their own intelligence obvious from their ships and weapons. That first level scared me, when you see the technician getting dragged under the door, the blood smearing the glass and then the sudden charge at the glass by one of the Skaarj in that room! Their size adds to the impact. Yes they do look abit gorilla/bodybuilder in that game but the more human in size and shape they become the less they would draw my attention. Anyhow, this is a race that arrogantly thinks it's better than all others, you'd expect it to be more animal than most wouldn't you...well i think so. As for unreal skaarj i never played that game but i've seen them in ut04 invasion, and yes they are cool, but as i said the U2 ones impressed me alot more. Ut2004 skaarj were quite pathetic just because they had to be toned down to be playable characters, which is fair enough......i was always slightly dissapointed you couldn't use their blades as a melee tho ^^.

                The perfect Skaarj in my opinion? U2's size and power, but slightly more muscular instead of wide. I like their armour and ships in that game too. Also i pick up your point about the face, maby a little less warthog like - the face was quite good in ut2004 i thought.

                Hey, i'd like to see that kind of Skaarj rip apart a few necris in a ut3 trailer, as they are so powerful they should still be around but just out of the tournament. They are Unreal Tournament's mascot after all.

                Comment


                  #38
                  You should play Unreal1, then.

                  Comment


                    #39
                    Originally posted by Hedge-o-Matic View Post
                    Whatever. The Skarrj make no appreciable difference in a UT game. They're just an avatar, after all. It isn't like in an SP title, where the abilities and characteristics of a Skarrj opponent have an actual impact.

                    And if people miss them, they can always put them back in themselves.
                    owned, thread killed.

                    Comment


                      #40
                      Originally posted by da ghost View Post
                      owned, thread killed.
                      Just keep saying that, maybe if you keep doing that long enough it'll be true some day.

                      Comment


                        #41
                        Originally posted by Shadow Dancer View Post
                        You should play Unreal1, then.
                        I definately should!

                        And Da Ghost, thank kind of response doesn't exactly promote debate, which last time i checked was what these forums were for.

                        Comment


                          #42
                          Originally posted by da ghost View Post
                          owned, thread killed.

                          posts like this are not exactly helpful.... actually, who gives you the right to just say that like its fact, like you are right, end of story?..... Some of us have a very different opinion on the fate of a long-running nemesis in a game series, and i think you should respect that.... else dont even post in the thread at all. also..... (IMO) how can any real UT fan say the skaarj make no difference?!..... they are one of the mascots of the entire Unreal universe.

                          Anyway, thankyou very much to everyone who contributed to the thread, all of your opinions barring this persons were very much appreciated, its great to see some fans of the skaarj, who i personally think rule also, and even those who didnt really like them but put up at least a fair and reasonable argument i thank you also.

                          We shall see the fate of them, maybe theyll be killed off completley, but i dont think so, and i really hope not!

                          Also @ Jonny, its cool to see that we share a similar opinion on them!, and i agree with you 100%.... also on your remark about this post i quoted up here

                          Comment


                            #43
                            yea, they replaced it wit that danmed stinga from orig. unreal. very sad, although i like da idea of pasting some1 2 a wall...

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