What are YOU worried about concerning UT3?

[13XBMSPEC]

When it's released. If ever.

[Hedge-o-Matic]

Besides, you will have to fight vehicles on foot, but new dodges are still less then dodge-jumps. So another "plus" to vehicles - one more "minus" to gameplay.

But they preferred to dumb down the movements, that's the point.

Two disagreements, here.

First, plusses to vehicles are not necessarily minuses to gameplay. Obviously, the better the vehicle implementation (meaning balanced and fun) the better the experience if playing alongside them. People who don't like vehicle modes won't play them no matter what the particulars are.

Also, the terrain system of UT2 often made dodge-jumps less practical, since you'd skid to a halt against the terrain unless it is of a certain slope, which you could vault up. This means dodge-jumps were never a particularly great defense against vehicles, except perhaps Scorpions.

Next, altering the movement system for simplicity isn't "dumbing it down". To dumb something down, you have to make the change because users can't handle the full package. But our opinions, as people who still play the game, or who played for years, isn't the important one. It's the opinion of people who tried it and stopped early. The people whose voices are not represented on these forums very well.

Given that UT2k4 is less popular than UT1 at this point, Epic is right to take a good hard look at the differences between the games, and to bring them more in line with each other in UT3. If that disturbs a few of us diehards, and we leave the community, that's a small price to pay. The gamble is that for every person who leaves, more will return, or play for the first time and stick around.

The problems with the movement system have been cataloged exhaustively, and Epic is right to consider what effect this sacred cow is having on their pastures.

[Luseferous]

This means dodge-jumps were never a particularly great defense against vehicles, except perhaps Scorpions.

Not true, Its a huge help fighting Mantas, Hellbenders (skymines), Paladins, and Goliaths as well. It can also be of some use fighting Raptors and Cicadas under the right circumstances. The terrain system can also work really well for Dj. For example you can bound down the hill on Torlan using dj in about three leaps.

[B0T0X]

I have to say... of all of the things...

I am most concerned about the lack of dodge jump. I think GOOD change is good, but I won't know if this is good change until I see it. I've always loved the WIDE battles you can have dodging around over a span of 15+ feet. I'm very concerned that by taking it out these once large 1on1 battles will be reduced to a span of 7 feet or something... I don't like to be limited in an "unreal" world.

...and I don't buy the argment that it's "too complicated". A simple tutorial (as seems to be a sort of tradition with UT) would solve that. I was on a n00b server the other day... One guy thought I was botting and left (lol).. the remaining guy was genuinely interested in getting better so I showed him a few tricks.

He barely spoke english...

Even with the language barrier it took me all of TWENTY SECONDS to teach this obvious noobie how to dodge jump. He went from running around to dodge jumping in no time. If it truly improves gameplay, then taking it out could be a good thing, but taking it out for the masses?... That excuse doesn't cut it.

I also love Freon, so +1 for that.

[Boksha]

I can dodge-jump any UT04 map faster then dodge any of UT99 map, which match each other according scale factor. So yes, it slows down the game.

According scale factor? Care to give an example?
I can tell you right away that if you're talking about converting maps from UT to UT2k4 by just scaling them up 15-25% in units, not only will you not be able to cross the upscaled map faster by dodgejumping than the original map with dodges, you also have not truly designed the map with dodgejumping in mind and problems are likely to pop up, depending on the map.

So, if weapon range is reduced, d-jumping will not be "useless". (in quotes because it's never useless.)

Forcably reducing the range of weapons is an incredibly bad idea for many reasons.

And one more thing, With d-jumping you had a choice - to dodge at short distance, or to dodge-jump at longer distance. Now you will dodge at some midpoint distance, which will be either too short to fight vehicles, or too long to fight troopers. If Epic just scaled down both dodge and dodge-jump that would be perfect. But they prefered to dumb down the movements, that's the point.

Too short for vehicles? Actually it takes just a few seconds to confirm that a single dodge in UT2k4 already takes you a bit further than the full width of a Manta. As such you don't actually need the dodgejump to get out of the way. In fact, it doesn't help you get out of the way because it only gives extra distance and time, not extra speed. The same could be said for getting out of the way of, for example, a tank shell. When the shell is fired and you do a regular dodge, the shell will most of the time impact before you land again, so the distance increase you'd get from a dodgejump won't actually help you because it doesn't increase the speed at which you fly away, it just increases the time you fly (and as a result the distance), which does nothing if the time of a single dodge is already more than the time it takes for the tank shell to reach you.
Finally, if it does turn out a single dodge is not currently enough to get away from a vehicle, you could always change the vehicle. It's not like UT3 is exactly the same as UT2k4 with the dodgejump taken out. It's redesigned and re-balanced from scratch.

[ADiTheMAN]

The only thing I worry about on UT3 would be the release date.

+1 :> ......

[DX-GAME]

According scale factor? Care to give an example?
I can tell you right away that if you're talking about converting maps from UT to UT2k4 by just scaling them up 15-25% in units, not only will you not be able to cross the upscaled map faster by dodgejumping than the original map with dodges, you also have not truly designed the map with dodgejumping in mind and problems are likely to pop up, depending on the map.

When I made my ports, I only upscaled them enough so that the bot sizes made sense on the map. I did not account for non UT movement since those manouvers were not important to the maps play. So you could use them, but they werent effective unless the area allowed for them.

I believe that the original UT2k4 movement is good, just not appropriate in all areas of the map. It would hinder you or help you depending on where you were.

Ill have to agree with Demon Guardian. Its not the jumps, but the skill in which you use them.

[aightZz]

I'm worried about UT3 Xbox360 version will be limited because PS3 will proberly have a " user created mod' function and Xbox360 won't. There's a strong rumor on the net about that at the moment. I hope that won't hapen and both systems will be equal.

[EffeKt]

+1 :> ......

agreed....

[Sivak]

One thing I don't want to see is a repeat of UT2003. I had high hopes for that game and got it shortly after release. It wasn't 1.5 years later when UT2004 came out and basically phased out UT2003. I didn't get UT2004 until December of last year and got it for $10. I want them to release what would be considered the final game and not upgrade it and force one to buy a new one shortly after.

Other concerns involve the maps. For DM, Rankin is everywhere and no other stock maps are used on servers. In UT99, I would see at least 10-15 stock maps being used if not more. It seems the demo servers are popular, hence that map being popular. Maybe make it so demo can only play vs. demo and full vs. full? Don't know.

Actual gameplay is what it is, so I don't really complain about that. I suppose my HUD changing to red and blue when I play team games and having it stay that way for DM is annoying as I prefer my lime green HUD. Fix that bug please Epic.

I have high hopes for this game in the end though. This and Starcraft 2 are new releases I'm anticipating.

[DOMINATOR 978]

The only thing that I'm really worried about concerning UT3 is if my favorite characters from UT1 are coming back. Unfortunately, UT1 is the only Unreal Tournament game I have ever played, besides a UT2k4 demo, therefore I really don't know that much about Unreal Tournament, besides that it is one of the best, if not the best, shooter I have ever played.

Now, just because I haven't played the newer versions of the game, doesn't make me not a fan. So, I don't want to hear any comments when it comes down to that. Just because I haven't played any of the newer ones ($$$), doesn't mean I dont' like the game. Lol.

That's basically all I have to worry about is if my fave characters are coming back. I don't have to worry about compatibility since my 360 will be able to play it no problem. I know you CPU players don't like the fact that us consolers get to play the best games, and honestly, I can understand why. But, I get more time to play on a console than I do a PC, and since I just spent 500-600 dollars (dunno which, my parents bought it), on a 360, I'd rather be playing most of my games there anyway.

Also, this has nothing to do with this thread, but I'm going to put it here anyway (lol), I'd like to know a release date pretty soon so I know when I'll need to start saving up $60.00 to buy it. I know they're probably working as hard as they can so they can set a release date, but I'd like to know one A.S.A.P nonetheless.

I've heard rumors that Epic is going to release it around the same time as Halo 3, so they can mess with Bungie. I've also heard rumours that Epic is going to avoid the release of Halo 3, and release it before or afterwards. (I've heard more of afterwards).

I want them to release what would be considered the final game and not upgrade it and force one to buy a new one shortly after.

I have to agree, Sivak.

[Luseferous]

Finally, if it does turn out a single dodge is not currently enough to get away from a vehicle, you could always change the vehicle. It's not like UT3 is exactly the same as UT2k4 with the dodgejump taken out. It's redesigned and re-balanced from scratch.

Thats almost the worst case scenario from my perspective, nerfed movement with nerfed vehicles to compensate. Foot soldiers need to be compensated for the loss of mobility rather than vehicles bieng watered down. Hoverboards count as vehicles in my book. As you cant fight from them you are not a foot soldier while riding one.

Dodge jump works well for open outdoor maps with vehicles, it does not work well with DM style maps. Faced with this Epic decided to please the ut99 biased DM players. (Biased in the sense they do not like the Ut04 movement)

Ironically DJ promoted up close fighting against vehicles, as with it you have a reasonable chance of staying out of their line of fire. Loosing it will encourage long range sniping.

[Thorgrim]

What i am personally worried about, is that instead of enjoying what the game has to offer, people will be tearing it to shreds because it didnt match the exact criteria of what they wanted from it.... you CANT please everyone all the time, its impossible, and i think that the guys at epic games seem to be trying pretty **** hard for this UT.... and credit where credit is due, the warfare mode sounds awesome, the story-mode is a GREAT idea... and the game simply looks out of this world. And they are only the bare basic things!, imagine how many more surprises there may be.

I think its sad that die hard fans of a game franchise constantly scrutinise every release after their favourite (yes i think UT99 was amazing too, one of THE best games ive ever played).... but epic cant repeat themselves, if they wanted to rehash the original UT with better graphics, i doubt the response would be so good. The newer UT games have their good and bad points, but the bottom line is.... UT is still (IMO) the baddest shooter out there, and blows the pants off games like halo, which are overrated so much that its sickening,..... and which i find no more than average at very best.

The only thing that really worries me is the release date..... I really wanna play this thing!, and i am counting down the days, even though i dont even know when it comes out!.... i fear it might drag on for a long time.... BUT, as epic said, their committment to the fans (all of us) is that you get something worth your hard earned cash, and you get a game which seems polished and finished.... and if i have to wait for 8 more months for an awesome game then so be it ..... at least they arent throwing out a half-***** game to make money and screw the fans over.

[DOMINATOR 978]

and if i have to wait for 8 more months for an awesome game then so be it ..... at least they arent throwing out a half-***** game to make money and screw the fans over.

You are entirely correct Thorgrim.......Completely.

[Boksha]

Thats almost the worst case scenario from my perspective, nerfed movement with nerfed vehicles to compensate. Foot soldiers need to be compensated for the loss of mobility rather than vehicles bieng watered down.

If in the end the vehicles are just as effective, how are they nerfed? If a weapon or vehicle is made more powerful in one aspect (which, in a sense, is what happens if vehicles have an easier time driving over people because they can jump less far) and weakened in another aspect, that does not mean two things got nerfed. It just means the game will play somewhat differently. If you think that's a bad thing per se, maybe you should just stick to UT2004.