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Mod idea Warfighter

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    Mod idea Warfighter

    Now before you jump in and say I know what this is going to be you don't!

    I have an idea for the best modernwarfare game ever made. Been in my head so I thought I would share it with all of the UT3 fans out there.

    Currently too many PC games, and modern Warfare style mods drop the ball when it comes to weapons authentisity, sound, and even how their weapons should work. I have had this idea in the back of my mind for some time now and would like to share with anybody who will listen.

    First problem most games have is cover: While some games make correct use of cover via AI, and force the player into cover via hords of bad guys, they lack a system for a first person shooter game that corrctly simulatates cover, and supressing fire witch work in real life.

    IMHO there is a way to fix this:


    1. A player should be able to look around corners, and move his head and not just his whole body. At the same time he/she should be able to fire blindly around corners without exposing his/her body.

    2. Peeking over cover to fire. IE the player should not have to stand up to do this, not only is that a bad idea, but in online FPS games if you stand and shoot odds are your going to be hit by a sniper, RPG, or worse.

    3. Players almost always get around AI by simply useing cover better then they do. IE too many times AI/Players get into cover, and the player dose not need to warry about his/her head sticking out because the games says they are protected. We need to change this in particular to make a real and deadly effect if the player is going to use cover correctly. SO we need to make the player subject to the same rules of combat that AI are.

    In short when I the player run into cover I should have to keep my head down, or suffer the rath of said bullets comeing down at me just like the AI dose. Thus when I'm in cover in first person unless I plan to shoot I should point my head down at all times untill I take the chance and peek out to fire my gun I should be forced to blind fire, or even sit in cover for a while. (Note the player could leave at any time, just if they want to live when under fire in cover they need to be not looking at the enemy)

    4. Last but not least is controlls!

    Too many games screw up by makeing this kind of gameplay to hard for the player to do. My idea is that it's easy to sit down behind a rock/tank and not let your feet stick out right? One button should be able to do it. It's also easy to get into cover in the first place. Agian one button should do it here too. Last but not least movieng into and out of cover should be easy, and a fun, and last but not least an enjoyable event to the player, even if he/she gets their leg blowen off by a nade when doing it.

    (These are the major problem with modern FPS games IE the AI is vary realistic, and bound by a realistic world that the developers made, but the player has no such restrictions, and often can fire with impunity at other players online, and AI as a minor result. My way of implamentation would change all of that. The Player would be bound to the same animations, combat style, and even menuvers that his buddy AI, and enemies use)

    Thus we make cover a good thing, reinforce team work, and flanking menuvers, and last but not least make ground combat as epic, and realsitic as it is in real life, and the movies.

    Next up is vehicle combat:

    Agian the problem here is not simply that it's too arcadish. The AI is bound to the game world, has limits and the player dose not when it comes to moveing, attacking, and even killing other vehicles/ground units.

    First is controlls:

    A vehicle needs to feel heavy, clunky, and at times restricted in movement to create a realistic, and big feel to it. IE you don't see HMMWVs jumping off 20 foot ramps in real life because they would be smashed to bits when they landed.

    IE say your in a game that has you controlling a Tank. the number one problem is developers over compinsate for controll, and lose the feel of real tank driveing. It becomes too easy to out flank, and out fight AI, and some times unrealistic when it comes to fighting players wether on foot or in their own tanks. The problem here is not that the players think outside the box, but that the controlls are overly simplyfied to allow even a noobie to get into a tank and own all others around him/her.

    IMHO it's an easy task to reload a tank cannon, it's also easy to drive a tank, but it's not easy to menuver around slopes, get the tanks armor faceing the enemy, and last but not least hit the first shot every time. Too many games can get points 1/2 down to a T, but then when it comes to shooting it's all about spaming tank shells, and unlimited ammo/point and click issues.

    IMHO this can be solved vary easly with a simple system that dose the fallowing:

    1. Limit the ammo to the correct ammount that said tank can have in real life. Thus the player has to aim better, shoot less, and think more. Also if vehicle has said fire modes Like most APCs do: they should have these as options!

    2. Useing PhysX we can have wind sheer, correct calculations for bullet drop of tank shells, and larger rounds, as well as if a tank round will simply bounce off another tank. Thus we force the player to compensate even more then they would normaly. Of course recoil, and sound play a big part as well when it comes to these monsters of death.

    3.If a vehicle is **** in real life, it's real life flaws should be evident in the game world. IE Abrams tanks while tough on the fronts/sides, are easy nuts to crack with a heat seeking missile, or a tank shell to the rear end.

    BMPs: All have a major design flaw: that rear door is also the gass tank, hit that with a rocket, missle, or tank shell and it's over in one round.

    AA vehicles: While deadly to aricraft they lack the power to even deal with tanks, and have poor armor, and low tork/speed engines. They are mobile gunplatforms, not tanks with rappid fire weapons on them. On top of that they lack speed in the turret as well because their targets are often miles high in the sky so less speed is needed to hit a target.

    You can get the idea.

    All in all a truly fun modern warfare game is one that not only portats the AI correctly, but the player as well. He/she may be a well trainned soldier but that dose not mean they are gods of might with unatural skills, and powers that the AI lacks.

    Last but of course not least is sound. Many games try to do sound in these games and fail out right due to arcadish methods of enhanceing certen sounds, while getting overly manipulative with the real sounds.

    Case in point:

    COD has poor sound effects on everything but it's envirment, and explotions. The gun sounds are weak, they don't reflect the weapons in first person, and all sound the same in third person. The fact is guns are loud, proud, and hard to hear over. DOD:S, and BF:BC on the other hand prove that good sounds can make a game that much more emursive for the player.

    IE in particular the sounds these two games employ for their weapons are loud, and more often then not cause people to out right hide from weapons like Machineguns, and sniper rifles.

    In gameing the problem for sound comes in size, the more compression used, the less real the sound is, the less compression used the more real the sound is. It's one thing to claim to have killer sound, it's another thing to truly have great sound, and to have devoted a great deal of time into it.

    In BF:BCs case the Military currently uses that game in particular because the sound reperduction is so perfect that they use the game to rehubilitate veterans before they come home back to the States. It works well because the sounds are the real weapons, uncompressed and not tammpered with in anyway. They shot them out side, and then shot them inside. Thus perfect sounds all around.

    IMHO DOD:S also has great sound, from the falling of debires, to the sounds of bodies flying thats got both realism and punch to it. In fact the MG42 sound used in that game is so perfect many people told valve via the feedback to not change any of the sounds in the game. They claimed they were perfect.


      Of course the next bit is setting:

      many games do great settings. IE Alaska, Middile East, Afrkia, etc. The problem is getting it down to the point where the player belives it's a real place they are in even if it's fictional.

      Too many times in modern games they create a perfectly realistic location, and then for some reason leave parts dead ended, for AI spawns, and other things, your not supposed to go into these places, but in the end after playing a game for a while you get interested in things you have not done before, ways you never went.

      IE the player starts to explore his/her limits. IMHO the open world game format is perfect because it means that the player has no limits at all. Done right it means the player is basicly free to tackle and objective without anything getting in the way at all.

      Unreal can do this, Epic games has proved it more then once in the past that open battle grounds are not a closed thing to UT3. So my point is that in this mod a player should be able to had free choice and feedom to fight any round any way he/she wan'ts too.

      Of course there are the tiny things in maps that count. IE the watter falls, the fiddly bits around a beach head, the rocks near a cliff side. All of that makes the world not only look real but feel real. IMHO some games come vary close to the real deal, but fall short for the sake of gameplay.

      IMHO is not realism in everything not ballanced gameplay? Seems to me I don't hear soldiers whineing that one gun is too powerfull over another, or one tank has too much of an advantage over another one.

      Thus we come to the setting issues that my Mod would try and fix. Fully realistic levels. IE you walk into a storage room and whats in there? Well that depends on the what it's going to store. If it's a weapons factory odds are it will have premade weapons, in boxes ready to be shipped, doors that lead to places like the factory floor, a bathroom etc.

      IMHO the small parts of a game make the game that much more fun. Without all of these locations can you truly call your world real? I think not!


        While I can agree with a lot of what you said (especially about 'cheat view' firing from cover in a third person view, and AI being using the same skills/movement options as teh player), I'm not sure that a simulation like this would attract a large enough audience to be worth the time it takes to develop (but hey, if you enjoy it, why not). Infiltration for UT was about the closest thing that I have seen (from any mod or game recent or past) to try and simulate light infantry combat with most features eg: leaning, going prone, sprinting, stamina, bulk, iron sights, freeaim, damage model that can permanently limit player's ground speed, weapons colliding with walls and preventing you from turning (so that short weapons really do have a physical advantage in CQB). If you have the original UT I would highly recommend trying out this mod (and aside from cover it implements a lot of what you listed above and then some).

        If done right though (and I still believe game play & fun should be a high priority) a mod like this could be pretty cool.

        As a side note have you ever moved around in a flak jacket/body armor, full cammies, with a pack, carrying an M16 (with 240 rounds of 5.56 ammo), water, and kevlar helmet in 100+ degree heat? (it's tiring & sucks) Real-life is not usually very much fun.... (coming from a guy who has only ever made real-life weapon type mods)


          First of all, I've always hated realism mods. Just my opinion, don't read too much into that.

          Second of all, the cover thing sounds awesome, the sound issues can be handled with the exion mod. It uses 3d sound to its fullest. The 2k4 version was insanely addicting with its destructible environments, and the sfx nearly killed my surround sound. you could literally hear a sniper round whizzing by your head. As for the tank, If all of those features were in a game, a lot less people would be using tanks. it would make it too complicated for the average player to use. A real soldier might get in on it for the training potential, but that'd be it. I would like to see an ammo limit, but that would be the most I'd do to a tank. It's slow enough as it is. No need to make it horribly inaccurate as well.


            Thanks for the comments!

            I understand the need to allow for players to be able to use all features equaly and IMHO I would aim for that if I had the skills to make this mod come true.

            On of the first things I would say is that the mod idea I have would make full use of UT3s built in PhysX support.

            IE all the curtins in a map with curtins, would allow bullets to tear right through them with nice wholes in them after the bullet was fired, I would also make sure that things like couches, TVs, and wood were not bullet proof and could be chipped away at by the players to make the cover ten times more dynamic.

            Also for player models, unlike in other games I would use PhysX to simulate phabric on guns, and wind as well. IE say your a Marksmen and you have a M21 with no paint job, and instead a pece of brown/green fabric on your gun. You would be able to see that stuff wave around a tiny bit in the wind if it was a windy map.


            One thing I would shoot for in weapons is not to fall pray to fanboysim bull ****. M16A4s while vary good at range suck in close range combat. Why? they are too big, too long, and with the ACOG, or IR sights weigh just as much as a WW2 era M1918 Browning Automatic rifle IE 20LBs unloaded...........

            Conversly I'm not aiming for tanks to be simulations. I just want the systems they use to be there. IE Abrams M1A2 SEP/Tusk model tanks have camra oprated 50.cals, IE Scopes, and last but not least the best thing about them is the auto leveling gun.

            That would all be there in my mod. But the six gears, and all the other **** would not. IMHO I would rather have a 2-3 man tank system then a 4-5 man tank system like in real life.

            2 man: Driver/turret gunner, cupla MG gunner/spotter, thats it and it would be no where near what is in RO:OST, or other sim games. IE if your in the tank driver seat you have a chase view, if your in the MG seat you look through a Black/White gun cam. Kinda like in BF:BC only if you want to shoot long range you go into first person mode in your tank, and with the scroll button zoom, and change veiw modes via a toggle switch that could be bowned to any key.

            In short a simple system, that I know works. On top of that I would make it so if a tank is shot in the butt no matter what the tank is, or who made it they were going to be in truble big time.


              Sadly right now I need a team of modelers, texture artists, and programers to do this job, and me being totaly unskilled in any of this stuff would have to be just a head tester for when and if we got anything in game.

              As you can see I wan't to use UT3s PhysX to show off what could be done in a real modern warfare game with that kind of engine. IE smoke would be dynamic, dust, and dirt would be too, IE shoot the ground in front of you and then walk through the dust you kicked up and it would rap around your foot and be shifted around when you ran into it.

              I would also make an effort to make the first ever truly dynamicly simulated muzzle flash. It's not allways the same every time, it shifts a tiny bit, but always sounds the same.

              Thats what I'm going for an easy to play modern warfare mod with hyper realism delivered via sound, weapon choice, and the fact that all the systems in a real life battle avalible would be there, just in a bit more of a simplafide format.