CTF-Pulse [GREED][Alpha][Pics]

[Superking17]

Name: CTF-Pulse
Version:0.0
Compatibility:2.0
Description: A space themed map designed for Greed
Comments: None
Screenshot:[shot]http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/1055/screenshot00016.png[/shot]
Credits: Bersy's Greed video for the idea. Talbot for assistance in the development
Homepage:http://forums.epicgames.com/showthread.php?t=675383
Download:http://www.index.iamtalbot.com/CTF-P...e%20Alpha1.rar
Feedback appreciated!

[Superking17]

Bump

10 chars

[Ignotium]

I suggest you add the GRD or GREED tag to the topic name, otherwise no one will know this is a map meant to be greedy.

I'll take a look into it

[Superking17]

Thanks. I'll add that now.

[d3tox]

Interesting concept. I don't know how this is going to play. All its going to take is one dominant player camping the top to tilt the score in one direction. I think this would work a lot better if the stands were at the bottom, solely because having the high ground = having the advantage. You could leave it as is, but be sure you have a mechanism (or 2) in place for people to retake the top. Considering the goal is the top, that could prove to be kind of tricky to get right.

[Superking17]

I forgot to mention that the player is teleported to the bottom after he captures the flag in regular ctf. I was thinking of throwing all the players at the top of the tower to the bottom when the flag was captured, but I never got around to it.

[Odedge]

I suggest you add the GRD or GREED tag to the topic name, otherwise no one will know this is a map meant to be greedy.

I'll take a look into it

I suggest CTF-GRD-Pulse (I am a lobbyist for this naming convention).

Interesting concept. I don't know how this is going to play.

Have you even tried playing it? That's the whole point of alpha/beta test. Other wise, the mapper would just put pictures up, but that doesn't get much done.



OK... As requested, here is my opinion of the map at this stage.

1. I think the map has potential as a "king of the hill" type map. But you don't want it to be a "who ever gets to the top" wins map either.

2. My biggest problem with the map are the bots, oddly enough. Being an offline player, they are part of my testing team. I just watched a 20 minute round of expert bots (5 vs 5) just go link gun crazy fighting each other for the entire time (it was a bit funny though seeing all of these red skulls bounce around the map ). The only bot to make it to the top, grabbed all of the power ups, then went back down to be a link gun hoar.

While it looks like you have proper pathing, you need to encourage any level bot to reach the top. While this won't really be a problem online (unless the server adds bots to fill in spots), there are enough offline players for this to be a priority.

So until I can have a decent round (the one round I played with the bots, I was the only one to score points, though a few times I was chased all the way up to the top), it's hard to judge the game play.

Assuming that gets fixed, here are some random thoughts.

3. I would get rid of the weapon lockers, especially at the bottom of the map. They give you too much fire power to too many players at once. There has to be more imbalance. Add the fact that you place two power ups on the bottom level and it makes it a camping level.

4. I would really limit the amount of power-ups in the level to one, maybe two. They should never be placed at the "end" of the map (conduits), but rather in the middle. This might be a bit hard as once you reach the middle, you are usually out in front of people (like it's a race). Unless some one decide to camp or defend the top area, it gives that player too much of an advantage. If people do decide to defend the top (which is a legitimate tactic, there should be more than one way to the top and there shouldn't be power-ups easily grabbed at the top, like the X-ray field).

5. I would also make it a bit easier to walk up the long ramps (after you make that reverse jump pad jump, which is a bit odd as you aren't expecting it). The bots had to crouch most of the time, which may relate to the reason why they don't want to go to the top that often. In addition, I wouldn't rely on a gravity type volume at all as means to travel the map (it took me a while to realize it was there as there is currently no visual clue).

6. You might want to try and put the slightly higher damage weapons at the top of the lower area (before you make the jump up to the spiraling part). They should be few and spaced apart, but that should encourage movement which the map needs the most.

To me, Greed is about scoring in smaller doses (like basketball) with the rare occasion for a big score (like soccer, but maybe not the best example). But you should have to decide to be greedy or not when you get close to the conduit. Right now, the map doesn't promote that. It promotes getting as many kills as you can, then making a mad dash to the top hoping no one sees you (as they are too busy killing people at the bottom) or that you can avoid their fire (which will get easier once you get to the upper spiraling section).

While there is nothing to stop you from encouraging this type of game play, to me it's not fun, the "all of nothing" aspect of it. This is why I don't like CTF as once a player drops the flag, it's too easy for the other team to erase all that progress you made.

With Greed, as long as the skulls don't fall off the map or vanish (though it takes some time to do this), the progress you made have made earlier is still "in play". Sorry if I am rambling off my Greed philosophy, but since it's a new game type (for me anyways), now is a good time to think about the possibilities of playing it before we get set in our ways.

[Superking17]

Here is what I will try to do in response to your post Odedge:
1. I am going for a king of the hill map, but I am not sure how to make it easier for the losing team to make a comeback. Since camping at the top could be a problem, I might get rid of some of the health and ammo on the tower to prevent a team from staying up there for the entire match.
2. I will try to get the bots up by moving the bulk of the pickups to the third and forth floor to encourage bots to travel farther up, and they will usually start to head up the tower once they get to the forth floor.
3. I'll get rid of the weapon lockers, and replace them with a flak cannon. I will put the link guns on the forth floor since the bots seem to like them so much and I'll put the shock rifles near the base of the tower so they can be used to shock combo unsuspecting enemies below or an the tower. I think I'll leave the power-ups at the bottom for now, or get rid of one of them.
4. I'll get rid of the powerups near the end, and maybe a bit of the health vials. I might have to replace them with ammo because the bots need a reason to go up to the top regardless.
5. Which ramps are you talking about? I think you mean the ones that go over the shield belt bridge, but I haven't seen the bots crouching to get across them. As for the gravity thing, yeah, I'm going to get rid of it. The bots seem to struggle with it and it serves no real purpose.
6. I'll move the link and shock rifles to that general area, and same with the rocket launchers. I will probably leave the bio rifle and stinger where they are because without them the players at the bottom would be screwed.

[Superking17]

Okay, the bots can get to the flags easier now that I removed the gravity volume, but now the red team wins in about three minutes. They also climb the tower strangely. They translocate up and down ramps and use jumpboots regularly to get from one flag to another.

[Odedge]

Here is what I will try to do in response to your post Odedge:
1. I am going for a king of the hill map, but I am not sure how to make it easier for the losing team to make a comeback. Since camping at the top could be a problem, I might get rid of some of the health and ammo on the tower to prevent a team from staying up there for the entire match.

That could help. Also, as long as you have two ways to get to the top, it's a bit harder for some one to camp a single route.

3. I'll get rid of the weapon lockers, and replace them with a flak cannon. I will put the link guns on the forth floor since the bots seem to like them so much and I'll put the shock rifles near the base of the tower so they can be used to shock combo unsuspecting enemies below or an the tower. I think I'll leave the power-ups at the bottom for now, or get rid of one of them.

The flaks might work well, even through they are powerful, they may discourage player to stay at the bottom with a lot of skulls as it will be easier for some one else to kill them and take their precious skulls.

I would seriously get rid of the shield belt as that's too much added "health" for any player to have and move one of the two power-ups that are on the bottom flow to the shield belt location, then get rid of the other one.

4. I'll get rid of the powerups near the end, and maybe a bit of the health vials. I might have to replace them with ammo because the bots need a reason to go up to the top regardless.

Sound good to me.

5. Which ramps are you talking about? I think you mean the ones that go over the shield belt bridge, but I haven't seen the bots crouching to get across them. As for the gravity thing, yeah, I'm going to get rid of it. The bots seem to struggle with it and it serves no real purpose.

Yes. I just think the BSP is too thick. I spectated a 20 minute round and usually when bots did cross their, they had to crouch.

Okay, the bots can get to the flags easier now that I removed the gravity volume, but now the red team wins in about three minutes. They also climb the tower strangely. They translocate up and down ramps and use jumpboots regularly to get from one flag to another.

Does the red team have more players? They shouldn't be translocating at all as this isn't normal in Greed (unless I have a bad memory or never tried using it in Greed).

[Superking17]

I'll try all of that to, and about the translocting, yeah, you can't use those in greed, but I was testing it in UE3, and you can only play it as a CTF map there.

[Superking17]

Ok, here is what I have changed so far.
1. I have figured out a rather unconventional way of preventing one team from winning a match in less than 1min. Kill everyone on the tower with a cool beam effect when the flag is captured. I am not sure how well it will work, but it seems to allow the losing team to get in a few points and occasionally win CTF matches played to 3 points (Before it was 3-0, now it is usually 3-2).

2./3. Now that I have taken away their precious spammy link guns, the bots behave much better now and seem more motivated to get the flags. I moved the rocket launchers, link guns and shock rifles to the base of the tower, and that really brings the bots up. I replaced the shield belt with the Udamage, and got rid of the Berserk as well.

4. I got rid of the X-ray thing and the Invisibility.

5. I haven't had time to fix the ramps. I haven't even seen the bots crouching when going up it. Could you get a screenshot Odedge? If not, could you tell me where on the ramp they are crouching?

6. I put the good weapons up around the base of the tower, and left the bio rifle and stinger where they are. The arrangement works okay for now, but I'll have to wait and see how it will turn out for now.

Note- If anyone finds a bug in the map, please tell me!

[Superking17]

The 2nd alpha version will be availible sometime this weekend.