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**100GPing100** · 09-20-2010, 08:25 AM

Nice, but the lightning could have more diversity

**melissa_jo** · 09-21-2010, 04:07 PM

To me, the lighting seemed especially realistic. Maybe with differing fogDistance settings, we're seeing it differently. 662 light actors though, ouch, that seems like way too many.

I like the fact that the floorplan isn't "perfectly symmetrical". I got owned several times by LavaVolume0. Haha, that's a pretty darn clever placement for a hazard location!

Feedback from a player perspective:

I wish the level in the pool was lower (ledge to duck behind and, need to step up to get out) and wish the crates were scaled smaller, so that you could get under the stairs and hide down between the crates (or maybe hide a keg-o-health down there somewhere between the crates).
What are the 3 giant melted snowballs (encompassed by BlockingVolume11)... and why, oh why can't we play in that room? On the bottom floor, I wish there was a stariwell or ramp, or teleporter (back near PathNode21) to provde another exit. Overall, I think it would be more interesting if there were more cover items scattered around the floor plan, and maybe another (or two) set of door movers.

Technical feedback:

BlockingVolume3 doesn't fully encompass the wall sMeshes, so won't help reduce collision calculation. As it is now, Is it even needed? Those subtractive brushs representing window wells, could just set their collision properties to block. right?

Hmm, the apple pathnodes are set bDirectional=True
False is the default and I don't expect you're accomplishing anything by settng it true.

View}ShowPaths in the editor and note the BLUE path segments. The editor is giving you feedback, alerting you that bots would seldom choose those segments. By slightly repositioning the nodes for those affected path segments you should be able to eliminate the blue.

While reviewing the pathing, look for "bot frustration" situations. For example, at PathNode107 you have told the bots (via "ForcedPaths") to goto JumpSpot8. They can't -- a beam is in the way! The bots won't know that and they may stupidly keep trying over and over (shooting their translauncher disc toward the ForcedPaths jumpspot.

**rejecht** · 09-22-2010, 04:32 PM

My maps are primarily aimed at the TAM/Freon gametype, however, I make sure they are playable as DM or TDM.

Originally posted by melissa_jo View Post

662 light actors(...)seems like way too many.

The floor lights are required, then some for ambience, and then there are "corona lights" which don't emit any light (LightType == LT_None).

Originally posted by melissa_jo View Post

I wish the level in the pool was lower (ledge to duck behind and, need to step up to get out) and wish the crates were scaled smaller

Double jump height?
There were twice as many crates at half the size, but that impacted performance a bit more.

Originally posted by melissa_jo View Post

so that you could get under the stairs and hide down between the crates (or maybe hide a keg-o-health down there somewhere between the crates).

Deep water is a problem in Freon gametypes, where players could be pushed into the water to thaw, limiting their movement. That's why it's shallow so they can have a chance. At first it was intended for people jumping down from the top platform, to eliminate the impact factor.

Originally posted by melissa_jo View Post

What are the 3 giant melted snowballs (encompassed by BlockingVolume11)

That's only decorative. I'll make that more obvious. (It's where the crates would be moved in/out of the structure.)

Originally posted by melissa_jo View Post

On the bottom floor, I wish there was a stariwell or ramp, or teleporter (back near PathNode21) to provde another exit.

More options.

Originally posted by melissa_jo View Post

Overall, I think it would be more interesting if there were more cover items scattered around the floor plan, and maybe another (or two) set of door movers.

I'll try stuff out. I'm shrinking that area a bit.

Originally posted by melissa_jo View Post

BlockingVolume3

Did you find that it didn't work?
I did it that way to prevent wall huggers from potentially stopping up whenever they hit each separately subtracted+blocked area, which does happen.

Originally posted by melissa_jo View Post

Hmm, the apple pathnodes are set bDirectional=True
False is the default and I don't expect you're accomplishing anything by settng it true.

This is *currently* enabled as a guide for me. It's a 3SPN TAM/Freon adjustment--RatePlayerStart in 3SPN TAM/Freon doesn't adjust the player view when picking non-PlayerStart positions. This way, I can best select which direction the player is looking when spawned at those points.

Originally posted by melissa_jo View Post

BLUE path segments

I will take more care with these.

Originally posted by melissa_jo View Post

While reviewing the pathing, look for "bot frustration" situations. For example, at PathNode107 you have told the bots (via "ForcedPaths") to goto JumpSpot8. They can't -- a beam is in the way! The bots won't know that and they may stupidly keep trying over and over (shooting their translauncher disc toward the ForcedPaths jumpspot.

The bot paths certainly haven't been reviewed for some revisions. I will usually test with reviewjumpspots and adjust the translocator offset as needed.

Thanks for the detailed review.

Might make light in main hall a bit warmer.

**melissa_jo** · 09-22-2010, 06:47 PM

Ah, lights placed to deliver Coronas. I didn't take that into consideration. The FPS playing your map was fine. I didn't mean to suggest otherwise. If you already tried more, and smaller, crates and that hampered performance... okay, but without some (more) cover items I'd worry few people will treat as "interesting enough to be a keeper". About smaller crates in the pool (they are being washed?) I wasn't suggesting a specific jump height. Say it this way: as it is, seemed almost like "walking on water" when I ran across the pool area.

(BlockingVolume3)Did you find that it didn't work?

Works fine to block players. My point in mentioning it was the BV isn't wide enough to encompass the sMesh wall decorations and (from memory) those meshes were collision-enabled. My comment was just a tiny, nitpicky Helpful Harriet observation.

This is *currently* enabled as a guide for me. It's a 3SPN TAM/Freon adjustment--RatePlayerStart in 3SPN TAM/Freon doesn't adjust the player view when picking non-PlayerStart positions. This way, I can best select which direction the player is looking when spawned at those points.

In questioning it, I was trying to understand it rather than criticizing the directionality. Thanks for explaining. RandomPlayerStart mutator honors author-specified pathNode directionality (but few authors do specify) and, since bDirectional=True should have zero performance impact at runtime (right?) maybe you're following BestPractices and the pathNodes should remain directional in the finished map.

(3 giant snowballs) That's only decorative

Awww, I was just teasing! The way I worded it, I figured you would chuckle. It's an effective deco the way it is -- made me wonder "what's in there? why can't I go in there? Izzit radioactive?"

**rejecht** · 09-22-2010, 07:34 PM

Originally posted by melissa_jo View Post

About smaller crates in the pool (they are being washed?) I wasn't suggesting a specific jump height. Say it this way: as it is, seemed almost like "walking on water" when I ran across the pool area.

Washed? haha
The water ended up being decorative rather than functional. (I think the idea with the crates in the water came from nuclear plants.)

Something like this, maybe.
[screenshot]http://spectrum.ieee.org/image/37182[/screenshot]

(The FSI water doesn't draw right, however. The character is drawn on top of the water when knee deep. Probably a two-sided thing I have to sort out.)

Originally posted by melissa_jo View Post

Works fine to block players. My point in mentioning it was the BV isn't wide enough to encompass the sMesh wall decorations and (from memory) those meshes were collision-enabled. My comment was just a tiny, nitpicky Helpful Harriet observation.

The collision was disabled for all those SMs, but I forgot to block all in the BV--thanks, Harriet.

The BV shouldn't need to encompass the outer subtractions AFAIK.

Originally posted by melissa_jo View Post

and, since bDirectional=True should have zero performance impact at runtime (right?) maybe you're following BestPractices and the pathNodes should remain directional in the finished map.

Since it's a non-default value, it might add a few bytes extra in total, but it doesn't affect performance.

Another BestPractices, then, with navigationpoints, is to keep them a bit away (32-64 UUs?) from zoneportal sheet intersections, to avoid HOM effects when spawned too close.

Originally posted by melissa_jo View Post

Awww, I was just teasing! The way I worded it, I figured you would chuckle. It's an effective deco the way it is -- made me wonder "what's in there? why can't I go in there? Izzit radioactive?"

The water is radioactive. The player model you used now has cancer. (Maybe I'll add a Geiger teller sound in there.)

But yes, definitely more cover. Finding a balance.

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