Performance drop with recent UDK releases and the End Consumer price tag

[Racer X]

Hi everyone, I´ve got this question: has you been noticing a drop in performance in FpSecond with recent builds? I mentioned this in a previous thread, where udk was too heavy for laptops, and udk users were kind to refered since It´s ment for AAA games couldn´t to be ran in such platforms. HOWEVER there´s the question:
ARE we developing games that the averige consumer can´t play ????? because they wón´t run in the mid class desktops or laptops (there´s some restless IPOD/IPAD users complaining the games got too heavy). THe bottom line is:
are we missing the biggest part of the market????

Picture this.. 1)you make a simple game, no fancy textures or lights, just a silly car driving around, picking up coins.
2)cook it and install it, and it won´t run on JOe´s computer or your little sisters laptop, because ít´s too heavy on the graphics card.

3) only your cool supadoopa laptop can run it, or a better than averige desktop...

SO, is Epic really considering the fact that the most pperspective clients/end consumers won´t buy this and the BUILT with UDK will become piggeon holed as "hardcore, highend hardwear only"? which may be fine for some players but for kids at school or the game´s enthusiast, that CANNOT either upgrade or buy a new rig altogether every year or so, that´s not just viable......and that is NOT ViABLE for the developers!!!

What do you guys feel about this?

[Racer X]

Maybe the professionals at Epic would be kind enough to drop us line, RELOXI maybe ?

[tegleg]

even my supadooopa laptop wont run recent builds smoothly, although it is getting old now its still way above the min specs (apart from dx11 which could be the problem).
i get the feeling epic doesnt care for the average gamer and is instead going all out to bring the latest and greatest to the table.
if udk carries on getting heavier and slower ill be forced to more or less start again with my game using an older build, wasting a good couple of years work in the proccess, awesome wooo!.

[Solid Snake]

A PC I built six years ago can run UDK games. A laptop that cost me $1500USD can run UDK games. A new PC I built recently for $1000USD can run UDK games.

Thus, I don't see the problem.

[tegleg]

your lucky Solid Snake, must be something to do with certain hardware and udk not getting on then i guess.
the performance really is getting worse for me, im not lying or imagining it, its true, and it seems im not the only one.

[Racer X]

Yeah I know what You mean, I´m instaling today an older build in order to migrate my assets and polish things and see how it goes just in case the day that you have to choose between your car and a new computer to work with UDK, does come
But from a financial stand point Epic, could have a even greater income revenue, if their stuff could reach a bigger crowd, and keep "all out" attitude.
I´m not talking about a diferent, or second platform (UDK Light.. ), but give the developer a better set of tools to reduce the acuity of grafics to a, down to earth, performance. Because right now one has to fidle around in the engine.ini files and figure out what powers up performance. Wouldn´t it be nice (and not so laborious to achieve for Epics Engineers, I suppose) a panel with sliders to either cut or boost the specs of your game before cooking n packaging?
Going from "real people" to "SupaDooopahardcore"?
Bottom line: the devolpers aren´t going to keep up on this economy, prices going high on equipment, on the one hand, parents and gamers unemployed, on the other......I´m keeping my car!!!!

[Racer X]

HI, Solid Snake, the thing is that you BUILT a pc for games and other things I suppose but mainly for gaming, but the regular consumer buys a laptop for generalistic purposes, i.e a jack of all trades, so they want something that can give them that without going bankrupt, and 1000 dollars for a family is a LOT of money.

[Racer X]

we´re just talking about games, now image in architecture viz, the client get a fly-through of the project he´s paying for, installs the stuff but his laptop/desktop won´t cope with it cause its for generalistic work.

[darthviper107]

I haven't had any issues, the computer I use at work is relatively low-powered (2.6ghz Xeon with a GTX 460) and I can run things just fine.


I think there isn't really a problem, the people you're talking about with the low-powered computers aren't likely to buy your game even if it could run fine on their computers. Even if your game is Casual and targeted at that group then they're still not all that much likely considering the ways to get your game are most likely limited to Steam or directly from you, neither are options that non-gamers would really consider.

[Racer X]

HI darthviper107, thanks for you opinion
Hey, once a XEON, always a Xeon ! do not downplay your machine like that it´s a very capable ride.

With the advant of the Apple store a developer is in touch/exponsed to milions of potencial buyers, and not limited to Steam, or selling directly, so you´re talking about casual, non -gamers, and enthusiasts alike. And there are lots of ways to place your product in big stores. Who do think buys most of the small apps & games for android, Iphone,Ipad? "serious" Gamers?
As far as the unlikelyness it all depends on what type of game your selling, unless you do something really specific like FPS,MMO, etc.. something that would usually find in Steam
So UDK in not the sole province of GOW, Unrealtournament types anymore, it goes way beyond that scope, that´s what´s happens when unreal engine reaches democracy power to the people

[darthviper107]

I'm talking about UDK for PC--mobile performance should never change unless you specifically add stuff. As far as Mac goes--people have had lots of issues building for Mac, plus Mac has always had poor graphical performance anyways.

For most people it's unlikely they will be have any other distribution options other than Steam or releasing themselves.

[Jetfire]

UDK defaults to nearly max settings.
UDK has had several new (and in some cases, a bit costly) bits and bobs added over time.

Try turning off the unnecessarys in the postprocess chain or using cheaper settings on them, then tweak engine.ini to taste.
http://udn.epicgames.com/Three/AppCompat.html is how you get the game to change its settings for various pc's based on some autodetection magics.

[ironbelly]

Also keep in mind that UE3 is CPU intensive so if you have a low-midrange CPU and a high end GPU you are going to see some dismal framerates despite maxing out at 60fps or whatever in something like CryEngine or Unity.

[Solid Snake]

HI, Solid Snake, the thing is that you BUILT a pc for games and other things I suppose but mainly for gaming, but the regular consumer buys a laptop for generalistic purposes, i.e a jack of all trades, so they want something that can give them that without going bankrupt, and 1000 dollars for a family is a LOT of money.

If they don't want to buy a computer for gaming, then they are more likely to buy a console such as the XBox360 and PS3 ... which Unreal Engine 3 runs on.

we´re just talking about games, now image in architecture viz, the client get a fly-through of the project he´s paying for, installs the stuff but his laptop/desktop won´t cope with it cause its for generalistic work.

Having actually been in this part of the industry, the client is more likely to want this on his/her iPhone, iPad or would prefer if the architect shows it them. Also people who can afford to build their own houses generally have those devices.

With the advant of the Apple store a developer is in touch/exponsed to milions of potencial buyers, and not limited to Steam, or selling directly, so you´re talking about casual, non -gamers, and enthusiasts alike. And there are lots of ways to place your product in big stores. Who do think buys most of the small apps & games for android, Iphone,Ipad? "serious" Gamers?

Unreal Engine 3 already has support for mobile devices, and UDK has support for iOS out of the box.

Basically all the points you've raised are purely hypothetical and irrelevant. You bring up points like architectural clients, mobile applications for casual gamers yet Unreal Engine 3 / UDK already supports these markets in a proven way (that is to say, other people have done it or I've done it myself).

Another stick in your argument about PC performance, is that there is a service called OnLive. Quite a few Unreal Engine 3 based games exist on this platform, so even if the user doesn't have the raw performance down on his/her end they could use this kind of service.

I suppose your counter argument above, will be if the person doesn't have enough bandwidth on their internet connection.

So what's next? Let's blame UDK for a person's internet connection, hardware capabilities, income, etc etc?

[Shywalker]

It appears to me that you're looking for a “goose that lays the golden egg” type of game development software. There is software that does such but cannot produce AAA games. FPS Creator by The Game Creators from the UK is one you can use. You’ll learn that this golden egger also has compatibility problems and is highly used by individuals wanting to get started in the game building industry. It is much more like a beginner’s tool for those who want to have a try before they commit to a life of game designing. It has all the bells and whistles, just drag-and-drop, slide and click, check and uncheck to create a complete functional game with little to no scripting involved. UDK is not this type of game development software.

It is known that the frame rates and graphical capabilities has become much more demanding with each and every new beta release but they are betas and they are newer developed kits which means your hardware should be developing along with it. The specifications change as the engine develops more and more. As any gamer knows if you want to play with the big boys. You have to own the big toys.

If your focus of development is towards low-end users then you should use the low-end developing software such as flash, unity 3D, FPS Creator, etc which has the low-end user in mind. UDK is mainly designed for AAA games and requires AAA hardware such as custom built PCs and Consoles. Epic is a AAA game industry and will continue to push towards the latest innovations of computer technology.

So, your arguments are totally irrelevant to what UDK is designed for.