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    I'm confused about commercially selling a product

    How is an indie developer (team) supposed to pay 3,500$ for 3ds max, 900$ for Photoshop, 1,800$ for Dreamweaver, 1,800$ for Flash, 3,500$ for nFringe and 99$ for the commercial license for UE3 + 25% of revenue, I'm really confused.

    Even if a team was to make a sellable game, how where they able rip off 12,000$ just for the minimal required software to develop a game, probably missed some software too.
    And remember this is without adding all the costs for a website, DVD Covers, Printing and what not.

    I do understand that and agree that the products should cost something, but why does this seem to be the only career that is only available for snobs who's parents are millionaires.

    And this kinda is unfair (not that things would be fair in life) against indie developers, I mean big development teams and publisher studios have millions of $ as their budget so a couple of thousand for the software is just a fraction of it.

    Am I missing something here?
    Edit: I'm not trying to complain about this I'm just asking if I'm missing something here.

    #2
    Originally posted by Naike View Post
    How is an indie developer (team) supposed to pay 3,500$ for 3ds max, 900$ for Photoshop, 1,800$ for Dreamweaver, 1,800$ for Flash, 3,500$ for nFringe and 99$ for the commercial license for UE3 + 25% of revenue, I'm really confused.

    Even if a team was to make a sellable game, how where they able rip off 12,000$ just for the minimal required software to develop a game, probably missed some software too.
    And remember this is without adding all the costs for a website, DVD Covers, Printing and what not.

    I do understand that and agree that the products should cost something, but why does this seem to be the only career that is only available for snobs who's parents are millionaires.

    And this kinda is unfair (not that things would be fair in life) against indie developers, I mean big development teams and publisher studios have millions of $ as their budget so a couple of thousand for the software is just a fraction of it.

    Am I missing something here?
    Edit: I'm not trying to complain about this I'm just asking if I'm missing something here.
    You get a loan. Indie does not equal free production.

    Comment


      #3
      And how do hobby developers do this, by using cracked versions or what.

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by Naike View Post
        And how do hobby developers do this, by using cracked versions or what.
        Either that or some free/low cost alternative.

        Comment


          #5
          Yes you miss:

          Blender
          Programmer's Notepad/WOTGreal/etc
          Gimp/Paint.NET
          etc pp

          Comment


            #6
            There's always Blender (3D), Gimp (2D), NVU (web), Notepad++(scripting). All of those are free.

            Comment


              #7
              Why would you even need Dreamweaver?

              You don't need Photoshop for image/photo editing.

              nFringe is not required to write UnrealScript.

              Not completely sure about 3D Studio Max, but can't it mostly be substituted by Blender?

              Flash... well, it makes things easier for using Scaleform GFx, but it is not strictly required.

              Comment


                #8
                Flash can easily be substituted with OSFlash or OpenLaszlo.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Thanks for all these alternatives!
                  Can you guys suggest any good ones that suit development needs.
                  I'd be interested to get to know the programs a little, so when I start working on them I'm not completely lost.

                  What about the licenses of these programs, are they free for commercial use, just curious.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Naike View Post
                    How is an indie developer (team) supposed to pay 3,500$ for 3ds max, 900$ for Photoshop, 1,800$ for Dreamweaver, 1,800$ for Flash, 3,500$ for nFringe and 99$ for the commercial license for UE3 + 25% of revenue, I'm really confused.

                    Even if a team was to make a sellable game, how where they able rip off 12,000$ just for the minimal required software to develop a game, probably missed some software too.
                    And remember this is without adding all the costs for a website, DVD Covers, Printing and what not.

                    I do understand that and agree that the products should cost something, but why does this seem to be the only career that is only available for snobs who's parents are millionaires.

                    And this kinda is unfair (not that things would be fair in life) against indie developers, I mean big development teams and publisher studios have millions of $ as their budget so a couple of thousand for the software is just a fraction of it.

                    Am I missing something here?
                    Edit: I'm not trying to complain about this I'm just asking if I'm missing something here.
                    It's a economic effort and a risk you have to take if you want to suceed, just like in other jobs.

                    The point is, when you start a new studio, it's because you know what you're doing, you have experience and you know the mistakes, because you did it in the past, you know the industry and you think your product would be nice. Then you take the risk.

                    The main problem is 90% thinks Indie = free, and it's not.

                    Anyway, I 'm not the most appropiate to say anything, I would love if anyone with experience in this thread post his/her experiences making a Indie Dev Team.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Can OpenLaszlo use existing ActiveScript and SWF libraries? Otherwise it might get difficult to reuse GFx' CLIC library.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Orang3boy View Post
                        It's a economic effort and a risk you have to take if you want to suceed, just like in other jobs.

                        The point is, when you start a new studio, it's because you know what you're doing, you have experience and you know the mistakes, because you did it in the past, you know the industry and you think your product would be nice. Then you take the risk.

                        The main problem is 90% thinks Indie = free, and it's not.

                        Anyway, I 'm not the most appropiate to say anything, I would love if anyone with experience in this thread post his/her experiences making a Indie Dev Team.
                        I'd surely be interested in hearing some experience.
                        But personally I'm not there yet, I just hit 18 some months ago and I've been thinking what I want to do after college, I've always liked computers and technology in general and I was first interested in physics, then computer development but recently, especially now that I can practice at home with professional development kits, I got really interested in game development.

                        I've been reading everything from wikipedia to blogs about game development, different stages, different roles, how publishing works etc.
                        Currently, I'm learning the unrealscript and following some tutorials to get an idea on how to work with the program.

                        I have plenty of ideas for games, everything from story, gameplay, design, genre and pretty much for everything I can think of right now, my ideas just make my head explode.
                        I see UDK as a rare opportunity for me, and I want to use it.
                        So far this subject seems very interesting, especially that I've always been thinking of ways to create a game and wondering if I was able to achieve this in real life, game development seems to be just right.

                        I realize that most of the more experienced people here don't care, they see these kind of topics every day and after some weeks they just disappear, but I hope I'll have a fun and educational time here.
                        I don't know why I'm posting the story of my life here, just kinda popped out of my head.

                        Anyway, I guess my point is, I'm by far not a game developer, but I'm very eager to learn about the industry and how things work, everything from development to team/company management, this is why I have many questions.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Edit: Already obviously well covered by the rest of the topic, nevermind.

                          Originally posted by Naike View Post
                          How is an indie developer (team) supposed to pay 3,500$ for 3ds max, 900$ for Photoshop, 1,800$ for Dreamweaver, 1,800$ for Flash, 3,500$ for nFringe and 99$ for the commercial license for UE3 + 25% of revenue, I'm really confused.
                          Cut out Dreamweaver (useless) and cut out nFringe (easily live without) and you've already saved $5,300

                          Originally posted by Naike View Post
                          And remember this is without adding all the costs for a website, DVD Covers, Printing and what not.
                          Very few indie developers actually produce boxed copies of their game. It's all in digital distribution platforms and web retail these days.

                          Originally posted by Naike View Post
                          I do understand that and agree that the products should cost something, but why does this seem to be the only career that is only available for snobs who's parents are millionaires.

                          Am I missing something here?
                          Edit: I'm not trying to complain about this I'm just asking if I'm missing something here.
                          You are missing something. Most indie developers are willing to make that investment; from either their own salaries that they are earning in their other job, and they're also often willing to take a risk and take out a large bank loan to cover their costs.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by Naike View Post
                            I'd surely be interested in hearing some experience.
                            But personally I'm not there yet, I just hit 18 some months ago and I've been thinking what I want to do after college, I've always liked computers and technology in general and I was first interested in physics, then computer development but recently, especially now that I can practice at home with professional development kits, I got really interested in game development.

                            I've been reading everything from wikipedia to blogs about game development, different stages, different roles, how publishing works etc.
                            Currently, I'm learning the unrealscript and following some tutorials to get an idea on how to work with the program.

                            I have plenty of ideas for games, everything from story, gameplay, design, genre and pretty much for everything I can think of right now, my ideas just make my head explode.
                            I see UDK as a rare opportunity for me, and I want to use it.
                            So far this subject seems very interesting, especially that I've always been thinking of ways to create a game and wondering if I was able to achieve this in real life, game development seems to be just right.

                            I realize that most of the more experienced people here don't care, they see these kind of topics every day and after some weeks they just disappear, but I hope I'll have a fun and educational time here.
                            I don't know why I'm posting the story of my life here, just kinda popped out of my head.

                            Anyway, I guess my point is, I'm by far not a game developer, but I'm very eager to learn about the industry and how things work, everything from development to team/company management, this is why I have many questions.
                            Then your best bet is to join/form a mod group that is working on some project. Start small and you'll get somewhere.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by Xendance View Post
                              Then your best bet is to join/form a mod group that is working on some project. Start small and you'll get somewhere.
                              Hey, yeah that was the plan, but for now I'm just doing stuff alone and see how things work out.
                              Later when I'm more experienced I will start forming a team.
                              But for now just stay alone, would be pointless to form a team if I can't contribute to it in any way.

                              Oh, almost forgot, can someone suggest any of those free software?

                              Comment

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