Games For Windows Live

[jfrizzle14]

hey epic, are yall still thinking about cross platform online or the LIVE service

[booshack]

This was denied in one of the e3 interviews IIRC.

[RogueA]

Cross platform will not work because of the fact that the PS3 and 360 games had to be slowed down to accommodate the controller interface and the console audience.

[jbizzler]

Also, if you look at the UT3 box art, you'll realize it's not even Games For Windows, let alone Live. Mark Rein did say they might still have cross-platform play between PC and PS3, but there'd be a lot of hoops to jump though.

[Mr.UglyPants]

thank god its not game for Games for windows Live, alot of Unreal fans would be pissed if they had to upgrade to vista just to play UT3 (myself included.)

[Mort_Q]

They could always make a mutator to slow down the PC and change the hitboxes and the like to match the console play for cross-platform play.

The key word is could... not to confused with should, or even will.

[Destini]

The key word is could... not to confused with should, or even will.

ha, that made me laugh

[RogueA]

They could always make a mutator to slow down the PC and change the hitboxes and the like to match the console play for cross-platform play.

The key word is could... not to confused with should, or even will.

You could, but PC players would still RAPE console players because of the speed and accuracy that playing with a mouse gives you. Slowing it down and increasing hitbox size would just make PC players dominate that much more.

[jbizzler]

Mouse/keyboard vs controller is really not that big of a difference. I have Shadowrun for the PC, and I have a 360 controller, so I alternate ebwteen the two and I perform exactly the same. In UT3 interviews, the developers have said the same thing.

Where does anything say the console versions are slowed down?

[jfrizzle14]

Mouse/keyboard vs controller is really not that big of a difference. I have Shadowrun for the PC, and I have a 360 controller, so I alternate ebwteen the two and I perform exactly the same. In UT3 interviews, the developers have said the same thing.

Where does anything say the console versions are slowed down?

agreed, ppl act like it such a big difference between consoles and kb/m. if your good with a controller on fps maybe u could own the kb/m person. same goes with kb/m

[Mort_Q]

Where does anything say the console versions are slowed down?

Slower and slightly larger collision cylinders.

http://www.beyondunreal.com/content/articles/198_1.php

Having said that, the game will not feel identical on each platform, as we’ve tweaked the game for each platform so as not to compromise the game play on any system. The game plays a bit slower on the console versions, and there is some aiming help (although the system we’ve developed, while very effective, feels quite subtle).

[Miko]

Its probably going to be played at a locked frame rate for PS3 version so it wont burn out the console. That and Aim assistance would probably very limited. Mark Rein and Jeff Morris say the games on PC and PS3 platforms are nearly identical. That is with the exception of the control schemes of the game on each platform. Slightly larger collision boxes wouldn't hurt the game at all and Aim help is probably controllable for the sake of options. The optional part being speculation though.

[snilloconator]

thank god its not game for Games for windows Live, alot of Unreal fans would be pissed if they had to upgrade to vista just to play UT3 (myself included.)

AMEN UglyPants!!! So tired of seeing the M$ live bs.....

[Mark Rein]

UT3 does not use Games for Windows LIVE. We have not decided about cross platform play between PC and PS3. We're not 100% sure that users want that feature but if we get time we'll play around with it and see how it works. In the mean time we plan to be able to serve the PS3 from PC servers so that should help us gets lots of great servers going.

[theeDEATHMASTER]

Well I hope you make it at least an option if not in the standard server lists (checkbox for 'show console servers' or whatever). Mandatory lists without specification is probably my worst nightmare to say the least, but that's impossible

[chu::LOB::]

console vs. pc could spawn whole new realms of fun/competition and keep the community larger/longer/more active...

[3Deeing]

I'm sorry, but I bought Shadowrun, and now, really wish I could sell it due to the horrible "cross-platform" experience I've been having.

Not saying the game is bad per se, but just trying to play it even with "Gold" membership is a chore. In UT2k4, I can load the game and be online in less than a minute. In Shadowrun, it usually takes at least 4-5 minutes, and sometimes I have to sign off and try again later when there's no open online games.

[Lostsoul]

console vs. pc could spawn whole new realms of fun/competition and keep the community larger/longer/more active...

Not sure fun is the right word...

[fuegerstef]

Very good to hear, Mark, thanks a lot.

[Molgan]

Good stuff, GfW ftl.

[void]

UT3 does not use Games for Windows LIVE. We have not decided about cross platform play between PC and PS3. We're not 100% sure that users want that feature but if we get time we'll play around with it and see how it works. In the mean time we plan to be able to serve the PS3 from PC servers so that should help us gets lots of great servers going.

Mark, could'nt you just leave that decision up to the communties by having a game server option that filters who (PS3/PC) can connect and what controller scheme restrictions (if any) that applies to the game session?

That would also make the decision to include, say PS3 M/K controlling, less likely to stir up the old controller debate. One could just browse and connect to the servers that floats one's boat.

[Sir_Brizz]

thank god its not game for Games for windows Live, alot of Unreal fans would be pissed if they had to upgrade to vista just to play UT3 (myself included.)

GFWL already has enough problems without people spreading lies about it. GFWL runs on XP.

[3Deeing]

I think the community as a whole has already made it clear the time necessary to make such a thing work good isn't worth it.

If the collision boxes for meshes are larger on consoles to help performance, and character movement is also slower, do you think a guy that just spent over $2000 on his PC wants to be limited by that $400 or $600 console?

I don't think so.

[Mort_Q]

Mark, could'nt you just leave that decision up to the communties by having a game server option that filters who (PS3/PC) can connect and what controller scheme restrictions (if any) that applies to the game session?

That would also make the decision to include, say PS3 M/K controlling, less likely to stir up the old controller debate. One could just browse and connect to the servers that floats one's boat.

If it was free, I'm sure they would. It is however, not free. It takes staff time and company resources (and therefore money) to make these things work.

They, in my opinion, would want to know that they were getting something out of it in terms of customer usage, etc., before they make it.

[jbizzler]

I'm sorry, but I bought Shadowrun, and now, really wish I could sell it due to the horrible "cross-platform" experience I've been having.

Not saying the game is bad per se, but just trying to play it even with "Gold" membership is a chore. In UT2k4, I can load the game and be online in less than a minute. In Shadowrun, it usually takes at least 4-5 minutes, and sometimes I have to sign off and try again later when there's no open online games.

That's not a cross-platform thing, that's a Shadowrun thing. It's match-making is super-slow. I think not a lot of people play it as well, so it takes a while to find a good server.

In Halo 2 it'd take quite some time as well, but most of the console world didn't mind. I did becasue I'm so so used to the quickness of UT2004 like you said.

Gears of War, finding a match is my worst complaint. It takes like three tries to actually connect to a server for me, and when I do, usually the host quits because his friends didn't make it into the match. PC community is simply more in-tune with how long it takes them to start playing.

It might just be a Live thing. I'm sure if they let PS3 players browse through PC server lists, they'd connect just as fast as we do with UT2004.

[void]

I think the community as a whole has already made it clear the time necessary to make such a thing work good isn't worth it.

Surely, it will not drain that much resources to make a game server host option and a corresponding PS3/PC game client browser filter. I mean really - this is as basic as coding goes and the easiest and most complete solution that makes sure everyone can have it their way. So again, let the community decide and let Epic show the way for consoles to do this stuff - without the silly windows live poop.

If the collision boxes for meshes are larger on consoles to help performance, and character movement is also slower, do you think a guy that just spent over $2000 on his PC wants to be limited by that $400 or $600 console?

I don't think so.

Well, don't do consoles any favours if they are connected to a game session with mixed (pc & ps3) clients. If they wan't auto-aim, and other console treats they'll have to connect to a PS3 only game. Otherwise, they are on their own!

[void]

If it was free, I'm sure they would. It is however, not free. It takes staff time and company resources (and therefore money) to make these things work.

They are trendsetting here. And the coding is basic. Along the lines of selecting a map.

They, in my opinion, would want to know that they were getting something out of it in terms of customer usage, etc., before they make it.

Sorry. But the best way to actually find out is to make it. So many has talked about this so much, that it would be refreshing if someone actually went out and did something about it. And as a Xbox 360 owner, I do not think that the "Shadow Run" way is the way to go. That's only MS wanting to sell Vista and have people pay for online play on pc's.

[Odion]

Windows Live is coming to XP, and it is still free to Play Online Pc to PC, plus I would guess that cross platform gaming would be more likely on PC to 360.

[RyGaR]

UT3 does not use Games for Windows LIVE. We have not decided about cross platform play between PC and PS3. We're not 100% sure that users want that feature but if we get time we'll play around with it and see how it works. In the mean time we plan to be able to serve the PS3 from PC servers so that should help us gets lots of great servers going.

I want it mark. Would it be possible to work on it and maybe add it in as a downloadble patch later on down the road?

Cross-platform on specifically determined servers is a good idea too i think. This was PC and consolers can play vs eachother for a larger community, and cross platform mods too.

Surely, it will not drain that much resources to make a game server host option and a corresponding PS3/PC game client browser filter. I mean really - this is as basic as coding goes and the easiest and most complete solution that makes sure everyone can have it their way. So again, let the community decide and let Epic show the way for consoles to do this stuff - without the silly windows live poop.


Well, don't do consoles any favours if they are connected to a game session with mixed (pc & ps3) clients. If they wan't auto-aim, and other console treats they'll have to connect to a PS3 only game. Otherwise, they are on their own!

I couldn't aggree with you more void. It would be nice to at least have the choice to choose between Cross platform server with PC and PS3 or one platform only servers. Makes perfect sense too me.

The only way we'll see how well it works is if epic actually does it, we can speculate all day but in the end action speaks louder then words.

[LoveFest]

UT3 does not use Games for Windows LIVE. We have not decided about cross platform play between PC and PS3. We're not 100% sure that users want that feature but if we get time we'll play around with it and see how it works. In the mean time we plan to be able to serve the PS3 from PC servers so that should help us gets lots of great servers going.

I know a lot of guys from my company that would love to be able to have both for LAN party purposes.

There are guys at my work that are 40ish--50ish in age that don't want to shell out 2k for a PC, but are very comfortable buying a PS3 for Unreal (they like the camaraderie and the pretty graphics).

[SuperDre]

I also do hope you keep at least the crossplatform capabilities in the UT3 engine so us modders can use it (not every mod would be suitable for crossplatform, but there are enough people out there who can create mods with gameplay that can be crossplatform (and gathering from cliffy's remark awhile ago about not wanting to see any WW2 or Counterterr mod in the next MSUC, you want to see some new gameplay).
I hope you build into the servers an option to exclude specific platforms from that server (and ofcourse as mod makers we would like to be able to get that info for showing up in browser (please create small icons in standard UT3 so everybody doesn't have to make their own icons if they don't want to)), and let us be able to easily get the info on the client (so we can show in fragscore menu the players with an indication which platform they are running on)..
So please let us mod makers (and server operators) be able to decide if we want to play it crossplatform.. otherwise what's the point for us to create a mod (or have support) for the PS3 other then just testing some stuff for fun..

[void]

...otherwise what's the point for us to create a mod (or have support) for the PS3 other then just testing some stuff for fun..

Good point!

[Destini]

Aslong as the auto-aim and other differences etc are removed, I see nothing wrong with cross platform, infact I think it would be brilliant in more than doubling the size of the community. If it was to work, the PS3 player would be able to automatically download a map they don't have when the server changes right?

[intentsly]

Thanks for the response Mark. I, for one, do not care if there is cross-platform play. It would be interesting, but until the contoller mechanisms could be on par with PC mouse/keyboard, I don't think its worth the time.

Intentsly

[void]

Thanks for the response Mark. I, for one, do not care if there is cross-platform play. It would be interesting, but until the contoller mechanisms could be on par with PC mouse/keyboard, I don't think its worth the time.

Intentsly

The PS3 version has mouse/keyboard, which btw is another reason to make it possible to filter game sessions in the first place. It's the easiest way to keep everybody happy, and to grow the UT3 segment in total.

Pure PS3 game session could be restricted to only native joy-pads, but when playing cross platform the PS3 M/K could be activated. All on equal terms with the PC, Mac or whatever.

Again, everybody has a preference, everybody has an opinion, everybody has a bias, so please just let the community organize themselves as they see fit. Mark, please do not decide this for us. Just provide us with the mechanisms to get out of each others way - or to meet up for those of us who fancy that.

May the best player win...

[alfanzo]

The PS3 version has mouse/keyboard, which btw is another reason to make it possible to filter game sessions in the first place. It's the easiest way to keep everybody happy, and to grow the UT3 segment in total.

Pure PS3 game session could be restricted to only native joy-pads, but when playing cross platform the PS3 M/K could be activated. All on equal terms with the PC, Mac or whatever.

Again, everybody has a preference, everybody has an opinion, everybody has a bias, so please just let the community organize themselves as they see fit. Mark, please do not decide this for us. Just provide us with the mechanisms to get out of each others way - or to meet up for those of us who fancy that.

May the best player win...

i think that would just put new players off and shrink the community...nobody likes losing all the time lol

if it could be implemented, imo best thing would be for:

(a) PS3 mouse/keyboard players being obligated to share the PC's hitbox size and speed etc and therefore play in the same servers as PC players

(b) servers to be either kbd&mouse/pad only or cross-platform (both controller options)..in which to be honest i don't think the ability gap to be as large as many make out.

(c) this gap could be closed or atleast narrowed by making a compromise in speed/hitboxes

in short i want the option to play my mates who are console players!

[eluna]

FPS game like CS Source, M/K do bring alots gap compare with controller.

But for sure, if gamer playing fps game for PC many years. They do have more speed compare to controller, really insane in killing with accurate. controller can't do such.

[void]

i think that would just put new players off and shrink the community...nobody likes losing all the time lol

Nobody has to due to platform or controller setup if this is implemented.

[void]

if it could be implemented, imo best thing would be for:

(a) PS3 mouse/keyboard players being obligated to share the PC's hitbox size and speed etc and therefore play in the same servers as PC players

Yep. Gloves are off when the PS3 play in PC/Mac enviroments.

(b) servers to be either kbd&mouse/pad only or cross-platform (both controller options)..in which to be honest i don't think the ability gap to be as large as many make out.

(c) this gap could be closed or atleast narrowed by making a compromise in speed/hitboxes

Perhaps it's easier if UT3 simply can restrict game sessions to "Console Mode" as compared to "PC mode". In "Console Mode" you can only play on consoles, with their native controllers and the autoaim and other help are enabled.

But if you as a console player connects to a "PC Mode", then you get no special treatment. You can play using the controller, but dont come crying because you brought a knife to a gunfight. As a console player, You'd better suit up (i.e do M/K or something similar) if you want to play with the big boys. Otherwise I'm sure they wont mind the extra frags

So, in summation, we could keep it this simple:
- "PC Mode" = No help, no favours, any control scheme goes.
- "Console Mode" = Consoles only, Joypads only, autoaim and what gives

With this setup the console purists can have their isles, the PC people wont be held back, but both can choose to meet up on equal terms, which is PC-Style.

[alfanzo]

Yep. Gloves are off when the PS3 play in PC/Mac enviroments.


Perhaps it's easier if UT3 simply can restrict game sessions to "Console Mode" as compared to "PC mode". In "Console Mode" you can only play on consoles, with their native controllers and the autoaim and other help are enabled.

But if you as a console player connects to a "PC Mode", then you get no special treatment. You can play using the controller, but dont come crying because you brought a knife to a gunfight. As a console player, You'd better suit up (i.e do M/K or something similar) if you want to play with the big boys. Otherwise I'm sure they wont mind the extra frags

So, in summation, we could keep it this simple:
- "PC Mode" = No help, no favours, any control scheme goes.
- "Console Mode" = Consoles only, Joypads only, autoaim and what gives

With this setup the console purists can have their isles, the PC people wont be held back, but both can choose to meet up on equal terms, which is PC-Style.

fair point void...atlast someone not so ignorant to consider the options lol

i largely agree, the modes are an excellent idea. but if epic could implement it, i would still prefer my (c); a compromise between the console and pc speed/hitbox size etc.

just to add actually...i think a pc lobby would be a godsend this time round.

i remembr playin a free fps called WarRock..everything about it was poor, from gameplay to netcode to graphics but the lobby and PMing u could do made making match ups with friends, clans or anyone EASY..something ut has consistently lacked.