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View Full Version : Facial Expressions and Gestures



General_Fear
08-25-2006, 09:44 PM
In UT2004 and UT there were no facial expressions. But the gestures were pretty good. I think the UE3 should be powerfull enough to do these things.

What your face should do:

>When you get shot or hurt your face should do something, not just always stay the same.

>When the character is dead, your eyes should close. Just seeing
dead bodies with their eyes open isnt quite right. Is this why some of the characters wear sunglasses?

>Once you kill someone you might just start laughing or smiling.

>With the voice recognition; if you say something into your microphone, your face might repeat the words you say. Now that would be nice.

>The characters blinking!

I know that the face might only be a tiny little detail, but if its improved itll add alot to the game.

What gestures that could be added:

>The finger details have been improved alot, so why not have your character stick the middle finger at your opponents.


One other thing is, when the portraits pop up; they shouldnt just be pictures, they should talk and say what's being said.

HellFox
08-25-2006, 09:46 PM
i completely agree with you
and personally i think right now it sucks the fact that ut2007 doesnt seems to have such things
simple entering/exiting stuff, hoverbord exiting, hands on wepons included :/

Scylla
08-25-2006, 09:58 PM
Indeed, I'd love to have pointless features which you would never see.
I'd never be stupid enough to get close enough to see what their facial expression is.

Oh the laughing, it already exists. It's called auto taunt, unless you suggest EVERYONE heres it, and that would get annoying hearing laughter in a public DM server every 2 mins.

When the human body dies, it doesn't automatically close it's eyes.

We already have gestures, they are called taunt gestures. K, L, and ; are automatically assigned to three gestures.

I don't see why they should have such deatail just on a picture, something that has nothing to do with gameplay.

I hope that in UT 2007, they allow the "turn auto taunt off" to work.

HellFox
08-25-2006, 10:04 PM
did you actually saw the last movie, in hd? when the player is in the inside of a base, he attacks a twinsould guy with a rocket launcher. he was hit once and he died. but all the time he was like: :I
i could perfeclty see his face

or maybe i saw more than the reality

InvadrZIM
08-25-2006, 11:08 PM
when UT2k7 was was first announced one of the first things they said was that the characters would change facial expressions depending on the situation they are "see" them selves in

Entil'Zha
08-26-2006, 12:54 AM
Oh sure, I'm going to get close enough to my opponet to see their facial expressions. But wait, oops I'm dead. Silly me for looking at their facial expressions during a high steaks match :rolleyes:

Gotta love those high "steak" matches !!!

I too am all for the realistic touch, yes that includes shaking breasts !!!

Malkav
08-26-2006, 12:55 AM
lol with all those facial expressions this game is gonna be too real for me :D,

Scylla
08-26-2006, 05:52 AM
did you actually saw the last movie, in hd? when the player is in the inside of a base, he attacks a twinsould guy with a rocket launcher. he was hit once and he died. but all the time he was like: :I
i could perfeclty see his face

or maybe i saw more than the reality

The reason why you could see the guy's face is because the person playing had god mode on. He was hit twice directly by a rocket but didn't take damage...

Meledictum
08-26-2006, 08:35 AM
In UT2004 and UT there were no facial expressions. But the gestures were pretty good. I think the UE3 should be powerfull enough to do these things.
Maybe the UE3 will be powerfull enough - but what about our PC's?



What your face should do:

>When you get shot or hurt your face should do something, not just always stay the same.

Hmm, if you fighting with enemy, oure focused on shooting, so you propably won't even notice the fact that your enemy's face is doing something.



>When the character is dead, your eyes should close. Just seeing
dead bodies with their eyes open isnt quite right. Is this why some of the characters wear sunglasses?

I'd like more when the enemy has hes eyes open - it looks more... brutal? ;)



>Once you kill someone you might just start laughing or smiling.

Yeah, just imagine, how annoying it could be. Rly cool. :/ Like in Q3, where you still hear somebody laughting.



>With the voice recognition; if you say something into your microphone, your face might repeat the words you say. Now that would be nice.

Again: i don't see any sense in this. Add a detail that players won't even see and it will suck you the power from your precessor. Great.



>The characters blinking!

I know that the face might only be a tiny little detail, but if its improved itll add alot to the game.

I don't get it - how the game could be improved by detail that nobody will se?



What gestures that could be added:

>The finger details have been improved alot, so why not have your character stick the middle finger at your opponents.

Why stick the finger? Better just type f** you - its the same.



One other thing is, when the portraits pop up; they shouldnt just be pictures, they should talk and say what's being said.

Yes, and the game will start to look like Warcraft3 or Starcraft. IMO the unmoving portraits are better.

Skorbut
08-26-2006, 09:22 AM
Why on earth we need portraits or animated stuff in popping up windows?


And what about:


Sound solutions and voiceacting in UT2007?
If UT2007 will have such a great voice acting and other great features then every character will have A VERY OWN RECOGNISEABLE VOICE!
Now tell me who the heck will ask for a 6x3 cm non-moving portrait poping up like it did back in UT2004...?

Adding live feed from teammate maybe?
How about making that portrait into a live feed window, just put it into one of the high corners of the screen.
The live feed would from a perspective, like the camera was placed on the armor and would show the face of the talking character it belongs to, and maybe it could show a very little background going on too.
If the character says "I'm getting my ass whooped right next to the Necris Christmas Tree! I need backup!!" then I wouldn't mind seeing that character's reactions and some of that cyborg super-tree or whatever is behind that player ;)


Look, UT2004 had place names that never even made sense ( like that Curved Corridor in Deck17 :p ) and when your teammate talked to you by teamchat, YOU SAW A DAMNED 1000 LETTERS only describing where he/she (which again, MADE ABSOLUTELY NO SENSE), THEN the 10 character message which was tried being sent PLUS a huge portrait (if you haven't sorted it out in Settings) - what I'm saying is, instead of this madness, try showing a bit of what's going on around the player's teammates, so you just have to take a quick look on the popping up 'live feed window' of your teammate and you gonna know where to go :)

Meledictum thinks it's Starcraftish or not, this could make a sense.
And if Starcraft had such a feature?
If X game has a shotgun in then there shouldn't be shotguns in every other game?
Heck, I played Tribes games and UT2007 will be light-years ahead in facial animation from that, even from where the Half-Life franchise and Valve can ever get with Source Engine XXX Edition or what-so-ever!

placebo
08-26-2006, 09:29 AM
I say that all the changes the threadstarter suggested will definitely be noticed, because even if they represent just ten by ten pixels on your screen during combat, you will DEFINITELY, almost subconsciously notice that the characters seem more real. The graphics are already there up to a few notches below photorealism, now we have to have the details which create a more lifelike world.

BlindRob
08-26-2006, 09:45 AM
the idea of useing the live feed from teammates like you could in UT but shrink it into a side window is a great idea.

Da Spadger
08-26-2006, 09:51 AM
Well, it does make sense that you look shocked if you take a flak ball in the guts. (Think DoomGuy with the Ouch-face-bug fixed) I wouldn't mind this in ut07 at all.

Hanji
08-26-2006, 09:55 AM
Maybe the UE3 will be powerfull enough - but what about our PC's?



Hmm, if you fighting with enemy, oure focused on shooting, so you propably won't even notice the fact that your enemy's face is doing something.



I'd like more when the enemy has hes eyes open - it looks more... brutal? ;)



Yeah, just imagine, how annoying it could be. Rly cool. :/ Like in Q3, where you still hear somebody laughting.



Again: i don't see any sense in this. Add a detail that players won't even see and it will suck you the power from your precessor. Great.



I don't get it - how the game could be improved by detail that nobody will se?


Why stick the finger? Better just type f** you - its the same.



Yes, and the game will start to look like Warcraft3 or Starcraft. IMO the unmoving portraits are better.
Lipsync tech won't eat much processor usage, try to do more research.

Hanji
08-26-2006, 09:56 AM
I say that all the changes the threadstarter suggested will definitely be noticed, because even if they represent just ten by ten pixels on your screen during combat, you will DEFINITELY, almost subconsciously notice that the characters seem more real. The graphics are already there up to a few notches below photorealism, now we have to have the details which create a more lifelike world.
Yep, agree with you, as the saying goes:" A little goes a long way." Right? Like you saving money in a bank, you do it little by little and after a while you get a lot of money, know what it mean?

Magwa
08-26-2006, 10:45 AM
Facial expressions to the extent you are talking about would be a waste of CPU power as stated if you are going around looking at people dying or are close enough to see them smile you are missing the point of the game fast action ,intense battles and $hit blowing up everywhere..:) i would rather have that same CPU power going into my FPS which are probable going to be at a premium

placebo
08-26-2006, 12:07 PM
Calculating the wheel friction physics on a Scorpion probably takes more CPU than a full 32-player server of animated faces would.

Scylla
08-26-2006, 12:32 PM
Think DoomGuy with the Ouch-face

I always thought that was a stupid and pointless feature. If I'm fighting I don't want to look at my face to see how many wounds I've got.

Not to mention it takes up hud space (even if it is only a little).

Morlock
08-26-2006, 04:14 PM
Indeed, I'd love to have pointless features which you would never see.
I'd never be stupid enough to get close enough to see what their facial expression is.
Modifications.

edit: and the ouch-face idea sucks. If you must have some HUD element cluttering the screen, at least make it a tiny green silhouette that can show injuries as yellow/orange/red or something.

Da Spadger
08-26-2006, 04:34 PM
I always thought that was a stupid and pointless feature. If I'm fighting I don't want to look at my face to see how many wounds I've got.

That's not at all what i was talking about. In Doom, if you suddenly lost 20 healthpoints or more, your character made an extremely shocked face. (That is if you played with a source port that fixed the bug i mentioned.) If this idea was in ut07, you'd know when you've landed a good shot when your opponent made that shocked face.

Also, i never mentioned about seing ones own face in the hud. Where did you get that from?

Scylla
08-26-2006, 05:10 PM
That's not at all what i was talking about. In Doom, if you suddenly lost 20 healthpoints or more, your character made an extremely shocked face.
Still, you would have to look at the face... plus Doom is a much slower game.

There's plenty of warning if you get hit now (there was before...), loads of red on the screen and distortion.


Also, i never mentioned about seing ones own face in the hud. Where did you get that from?
I thought by saying about the Doom ouch face you wanted it to be in the centre, like on Doom (if I recall correctly). Where else would you put it?

Da Spadger
08-26-2006, 05:16 PM
Still, you would have to look at the face... plus Doom is a much slower game.

Not when playing Hell Revealed 2 at Ultraviolence. (Custom level, in case you haven't heard of it before. I never get past the second level. :P)


There's plenty of warning if you get hit now (there was before...), loads of red on the screen and distortion.

True.


I thought by saying about the Doom ouch face you wanted it to be in the centre, like on Doom (if I recall correctly). Where else would you put it?

Oh, no, i only referred to the shocked face, not who the person would be to see it.

Still, i think basic facial expressions would be a nice touch, i wouldn't want it in if they would have to take time from more important matters like refining gameplay and such.

zeitgeber
08-26-2006, 05:39 PM
i dont care too much for facial expressions and gestures but i just wish the UT2k7 characters will smile a bit. just look at malcom and the other character on the forum header. its like they just got up

Scylla
08-26-2006, 05:43 PM
Why would you be smiling in a competition where if you fail you either get heavily injured or even die?

Remember, in what little story the UT series has, they aren't in virtual reality...

zeitgeber
08-26-2006, 05:49 PM
in that case a sadistic smile will do

Scylla
08-26-2006, 05:59 PM
in that case a sadistic smile will do

Do you mean they constantly smile sadistically or that their facial expression changes?

They would look ridiculous smiling constantly, and as said before facial expressions are a waste of time.

Emmet Otter
08-26-2006, 08:59 PM
http://img73.imageshack.us/img73/7743/ut20072bx0.jpg

General_Fear
08-26-2006, 09:24 PM
http://img73.imageshack.us/img73/7743/ut20072bx0.jpg

It looks like you just deformed Malcom.

And I think you made those breasts bigger.

Bagrada
08-29-2006, 02:35 AM
Hmmm. Someone (It might have been you) asked the same question on the Boyondunreal forums, and I remember seeing a picture that showed malcolm grimacing in pain with a shock core detonating behind him. I noticed that none of the other screenshots show that expression... It may not be noticed half the time, but facial expression and occasional blinking would really bring the characters to life.
I'd also like the third-person animations to be more detailed. In UT2004, the animations barely showed a character looking up and down.
With the immense power of the UE3, these features should really be implemented.
We can only sit, and pray. And sacrificing the occasional goat would probably help...

General_Fear
08-29-2006, 06:00 AM
Yeah that was me on the Beyondunreal forums.

iLL
08-29-2006, 04:07 PM
I say give me everything that this engine can do so long as players with less rigs can turn it off for more fps and Epic has completely honed all of the more important aspects like movement,weapon balancing,maps,etc.
No matter what gameplay should never be compromised though under any circumstances.