Unrealscript will be removed from UE4!!

[iniside]

Yes it is easier than C++.
And don't compare C++ and C# like they have anything to do with each other lol.

And engine ____ has been on the market for ages with free source code and only a very few company make games with it because it's all in C++ and much more difficult than Unreal to work with it.
And it is a very big engine, I can't say the name but you can pretty much guess if I say the company behind it is one of the most successful on PC, if not the most successful one.

I still don't know what are you reffreing by. If we are talking about semantics then it's not easier and not harder. You know one C-like lanauguge you know them all (each have it's own specifics of course.. but I'm sure if you are good you can catch to them quickly).

And if you are talking about ecosystem around each language. Consider that C++ have thousands of ready-to-use libraries. How many of them have US ? Yeah. It will be much easier to integrate them (say you need XML praser no problem!), just add headers and you good to go.

C++ is not hard languge. By no means. Unless you need to do very low level things. I don't think learning enough to code gameplay will hell lot of task. And hurders thousands of existing C++ will welcome change.

Yeah I know what are you talking about. I think there are diffrent reasons rather than using C++ for gameplay. More important is lack of proper documentation of code, and more important default sample provided also do not have any documentation and it;s wrote in very, very bad manner (I'm not purist but I like when code self-document at least).
Also other factors count. But since we talking about programming they do not belong here.

[Osmant]

Well I'm kinda sad because I really liked UnrealScript. But I understand that they probably did it for a reason, and that I'm not the main target audiance for them. So I hope to hear more at E3.
One thing that scares me however is, UnrealScript had some very cool little features for pure gameplay stuff, I wonder how that will be done in the new system. For example, I remember fiddling around with Source SDK, and this is how you make a simple 'actor'/'entity' that counts a numer up:

https://developer.valvesoftware.com/...Logical_Entity

So I really hope it's not that complicated ( to me at least ) Can't wait to see what they came up with!

[Crusha K. Rool]

Also don't forget about UnrealScript's simple and straight-forward way to handle vector math.
http://wiki.beyondunreal.com/Legacy:...t_Vector_Maths

I wonder if that can be carried over to C++ in that way or if we have to work directly on rotation matrices or use cluttering function calls to get things done in a similar way.

[iniside]

Of course it can. In what language VM for US was written ? Yeah in C++.

[Spoof]

Also don't forget about UnrealScript's simple and straight-forward way to handle vector math.
http://wiki.beyondunreal.com/Legacy:...t_Vector_Maths

I wonder if that can be carried over to C++ in that way or if we have to work directly on rotation matrices or use cluttering function calls to get things done in a similar way.

If those are your concerns then you have nothing to worry about. Most of what you see in Unreal Script is just mirroring what is already done in C++. The only major difference to bare-bones C++ is the state mechanism and latent operations... but we don't yet know what will replace that. This thread is mostly speculation.

[oranor]

I was going to try and learn UScript but I see now I would have better luck going ahead and learning c++. Unrealscript...you will be gone but never forgotten...lol

[MonsOlympus]

I find it funny that people think because c++ is a more popular language a million gameplay programming documents in c++ will pop up. If anything it'll be harder to find that information since you'll be digging through a hell of alot of nonrelevant information.

[Saishy]

I find it funny that people think because c++ is a more popular language a million gameplay programming documents in c++ will pop up. If anything it'll be harder to find that information since you'll be digging through a hell of alot of nonrelevant information.

http://xkcd.com/979/

Oh, the ancient scrolls...

[oskaroh]

I dont think that Epic's plan is having the users of the engine writing its own script language or integrating in someway others like Lua... that'll be pointless. Definitely there is some information that we are still missing... we better wait for the E3 (hopefully)

[Bonyback]

this is ridiculous unreal script can never be terminated it would be pointless cause if you knew c++ you could make ur own Engine

the interface that we use is based on unreal script

Forever Unreal Script

[Saishy]

this is ridiculous unreal script can never be terminated it would be pointless cause if you knew c++ you could make ur own Engine

the interface that we use is based on unreal script

Forever Unreal Script

[Angel_Mapper]

I've made my entire programming career out of UnrealScript. I hope the jolt's easy.

[Kenchu]

Wow. Well, that's a major turn-off for making anything in UE3, knowing that anything you learn in UnrealScript will be useless and completely obsolete. Unity here I come.

[Spoof]

Wow. Well, that's a major turn-off for making anything in UE3, knowing that anything you learn in UnrealScript will be useless and completely obsolete. Unity here I come.

Most of what you've learned with unreal script has nothing to do with the language itself - it's an API (look it up) that exposes the features of the engine to you in a practical and useful way. The API for the next gen is going to have a lot of similarities to the current one, so everything you know will give you a head start. Jumping ship means you have to learn a new language and a new API, not to mention all the quirks and characteristics of a new SDK.

[Kenchu]

Already know C# and Javascript, and I bet the API is more user-friendly and requires less hacking (oh yes extending existing unrealscript code to get your own behavior can be extremely hacky).

It may be a head start, but whats a head start to reaching the goal with another technology?

[Angel_Mapper]

If you're going to go, go. I'm not sure what you hope to accomplish by this.

[skwisdemon666]

Won't it end up pretty similar since most of what is done relies on extension and class inheritance? This will just open up "native" stuff to altering to specific needs, right?

[MonsOlympus]

Everyone can only speculate skwisdemon666, no one knows for certin what's going on. Epic will let us know eventually but if we can write our own c++ gameplay code we'll still be unable to change what's in the base libraries but it does give more overriding options since its the same language as the engine code.

I've never been a huge fan of c++'s syntax but there are alot of similarities. I'm not sure but this could open doors for writing a plugin api which simply maps the existing one with new terminology.

[Henrik]

If you're primarily a coder and have used Unrealscript for years and announce you're jumping ship to another engine I agree it's funny because you will have absolutely no easier time with the code there. However Epic implements it, do you think they are going to leave their licensees high and dry come transition time? And yes, licensees includes UDK licensees. I'd imagine some kind of import toolset, or plugin system for those who wish to use an Unrealscript layer still. I mean why not? I also wonder what will happen when you do things like copy objects or kismet nodes, since currently when you do so you get what is basically a load of unrealscript properties. They are going to have to do a pretty big overhaul if they junk it completely.

Let's face it, Unreal Engine 3 was a huge hurdle for most of us to get over, it did a LOT of things differently and especially now. The current UDK is already practically to the original UT3 form of UE3, what UE2.x was to UE1. Yet there have always been enough similarilities there that I didn't feel completely lost. It definitely grew more complex, but now Epic's goal with UE4 is in some ways to make it less complex. Do what you wish bros and gals but I'm going to give it a good chance especially if the UDK terms stay the same.

[Derp]

If you're primarily a coder and have used Unrealscript for years and announce you're jumping ship to another engine I agree it's funny because you will have absolutely no easier time with the code there. However Epic implements it, do you think they are going to leave their licensees high and dry come transition time? And yes, licensees includes UDK licensees. I'd imagine some kind of import toolset, or plugin system for those who wish to use an Unrealscript layer still. I mean why not? I also wonder what will happen when you do things like copy objects or kismet nodes, since currently when you do so you get what is basically a load of unrealscript properties. They are going to have to do a pretty big overhaul if they junk it completely.

Let's face it, Unreal Engine 3 was a huge hurdle for most of us to get over, it did a LOT of things differently and especially now. The current UDK is already practically to the original UT3 form of UE3, what UE2.x was to UE1. Yet there have always been enough similarilities there that I didn't feel completely lost. It definitely grew more complex, but now Epic's goal with UE4 is in some ways to make it less complex. Do what you wish bros and gals but I'm going to give it a good chance especially if the UDK terms stay the same.

UE3 is still planned to be the go-to engine for developers, just now with UE4 everyone seems to be forgetting that. Besides everyone's acting like they plan on releasing the engine today...

[Henrik]

I am prepared for and expect to be using UE3 for another 1 to 2 years at least, so it's no problem for me. In fact I kind of prefer it and don't feel even if UE4 UDK came out in that timeframe that it would necessarily be beneficial to move over immediately.

[MonsOlympus]

I wouldnt assume everyone here only has experience with UE though, like for example Ive used iDtech quite a fair bit in the beginning and during my UE development. We are talking about 1 to 2 years down the track, by then UE4 will be moving to support DX12 and DX11 seems to be handled just fine by UDK currently, the here and now is that DX11 has gotta push forward and leave DX9 in the dust but in my eyes mobile and console support is holding that back. Im certain with UE 4 this will be set to change but why wouldnt UE3 look just as good on these new consoles as UE4? Whats showcased is alot of CUDA from what I can tell and with the speculations on the specs for the consoles its an ati only race ahead, would this mean havok might be a better option to integrate if youre choosing to develop for consoles? Maybe itd help on tegra chipset mobiles but who really knows.

Basically 1 to 2 years will obsolete both the UE versions as we are seeing them now, the 680GTX is hardware available now and might become more mainstream in 1-2 years but most people have a decent mid-high range card thats DX11 capable now. All that needs to happen is going alittle softer on post process and hardware physics and your game will look great and run great. Obviously UE3 and UE4 will not run on current gen console hardware when rendered completely, there is the fallback options in UE3 but if the past is something to go by Epic actually skip a DX version in the transition (UE3 going directly to 9c from 8.1 in UE2.5 and then UE3 skipping DX10 pretty much to go to DX11). Ofcoarse its more about shader level support with UE3 no longer supporting shader model 2, this makes me take a guess that UE4 will infact not have any backwards compatibility for SM3 or DX11 and below.

In two years we saw shader model 3 come and go on PC basically (shader model 2 changed dramatically in the space of a few years also), the only reason the level of support is there from a software standpoint is because we are constantly fed cross platform developed games. Now we're on shader model 4 with views towards 5 and beyond, the next generation of consoles might hit in the next year or so but within the space of a year they will easily be trumped by constantly evolving PC hardware.

Already we have windows 8 in a short space after windows 7 and the rapid adoption after what some might call a failure in vista, windows 8 will be DX11.1 out of the box which supports even higher versions of directcompute and most likely shader model updates.

Anyway some of my facts might be a tad wrong or streamlined to keep the post length down, this is just a summary of the the last 6 years so if you really think 1-2 years isnt very long then youd be crazy. The UE4 we see now to the UE4 we actually get our hands on (judging by UDK build numbers) could be magnitudes different, Im willing to bet Epic (whilst down playing it) will always hold PC as a platform close to the heart.

[systemic]

I am prepared for and expect to be using UE3 for another 1 to 2 years at least, so it's no problem for me. In fact I kind of prefer it and don't feel even if UE4 UDK came out in that timeframe that it would necessarily be beneficial to move over immediately.

I agree with your estimate of 1 to 2 years, and even then, it usually doesn't pay to be an early adopter. As with any software, the first few months will be full of bug discovery and confusion due to the lack of knowledge resources online. Just think about all the UDK tutorials that are going to become outdated when UE4 UDK launches... that's a lot of education resources gone.

That said, I'm nothing but excited for this change. Epic is aware of their position in the market - they've put a LOT of work into creating UDK and a community of developers. They won't do anything to alienate all their efforts and users. Whatever changes are made to the coding system in the next iteration of UDK will certainly be for the best [in the long run] and, most likely, the future of game development.

[DarkCarnivour]

I'm quite excited about this and a bit wary at the same time. There have been many times with UScript where I've wished "If only they had that, it would be so easy in C++", things like polymorphy for example. There are also times where I have done things and worried about the performance implications because those things really should have been at a lower level, but I only have access to UScript.
On the other hand, I have invested many years with UnrealScript and have built up a fair library of code I use on multiple projects; including a complete non-ScaleForm UI system.

C++ seems like the better tool for the situation, but the change will be a hurdle of some height.
It will of course come down to how the new API is implemented and structured. I am really hoping it is similar and as (relatively) clean as the codebase we are used to. I will be less excited if I see another ugly, messy API like the ones MS loves to roll out.
I know that many of the awesome things that we are used to with UScript - such as modularity and reasonably uncluttered code - are technically possible with C++. When I experimented with my own engine, I was heavily inspired by UScript so I set out to implement the same level of modularity, simplicity and other things taken for granted in UScript (except for states). The good news is that it all seemed to work very well!

The change of language (C++ is similar to US anyway) is less of a worry to me than massive changes to the structure of the game and having to learn a new codebase from scratch. Interesting stuff, but I expect it is still a while before UE4 concerns most of us and I'll be interested to see how it relates to the UDK.

[BmB23]

C++ seems like a downgrade. It's faster and more powerful yeah, but it's also way too in-depth for gameplay programming imho. It's a systems language. You need something simple and quick for gameplay imho.

What I'd probably really like to see is lua, it's super duper simple and has loads of support online. It's pretty much the perfect barebones scripting language for doing simple gameplay programming.

[Saishy]

There is always the chance the version they got didn't had unrealscript just because they haven't made the compiler yet.
I mean, Epic has never said anything about unrealscript being removed or not.

[RNG]

There is always the chance the version they got didn't had unrealscript just because they haven't made the compiler yet.
I mean, Epic has never said anything about unrealscript being removed or not.

Epic posted the article on Facebook themselves. If there was a mistake, they would've addressed it by now.

[Henrik]

Yeah they said it.

[BlackHornet80]

I wonder if anybody keep in mind: The UE4 Kismet implementation will be much more powerful, than the current one (referred to the article). So i suppose what you do in UScript now, almost will be possible in Kismet2 (? we'll see how they name it). Under-the-hood functionality will be implemented in C++ (greater performance than in UnrealScript), and the "logic" itself will be implemented via Kismet (visual scripting and on-the-fly interpretation instead of old-fashioned offline unreal script and compilation)

Thats what I think how it will be in the future Now integrate Max or Maya, Photoshop and Audacity into UnrealEd and you have a 1-tool solution for making a complete game development ^^

[skwisdemon666]

Now integrate Max or Maya, Photoshop and Audacity into UnrealEd and you have a 1-tool solution for making a complete game development ^^

Impossible, because that would be OVER 9000!!!

I do love audacity though... best sound tool I have ever found.

[MereMortal]

"With Kismet 2, Epic empowers level designers—the people responsible for conceptualizing the world—to breathe life into that world directly, rather than relying on programmers to do it on their behalf. Says Golding, “We’re turning our level designers into godlike creatures who can walk into a world and create with a swipe of their hand"
Now I would never suggest we can do without programmers...what we have here is a progression that allows more generic game types to be created with templates and the like. This is cool because a lot of games are simply the same at heart and with a little slant and change of look these games will get by if the quality is still a concern. Making a game that is unique however must require skilled programmers to bring those ideas to life. I welcome The changes...I have over the years taken as much opportunity to convince those in power to move over to Unreal tech but most programmers I have accociated with have been wary of unrealscrirpt in favor of more traditional programming languages. I think with ue4 changes as read will attract more to the fold if anything. I have always said in the end there will only be 2 or 3 game engines, just as there are only a few widely used artistic tools. It has to be this way as the costs of developing your own in house game engine is huge and risky. A great leveling I say. Designers and Artists have tools to do most of the work required to prototype and programmers, if they are that way inclined, have a wealth of level and character art available online to them if they feel the need to go solo so to speak.

P.S. I look forward to the release of UE4 as in theory I shall be able to turn water into wine, preferably scotch.

[as2onish]

C++ programming is only as bad as all the libraries, dependencies and patterns that you drag yourself into. Clean C++ code can be easy enough to understand, work with, and extend. As good as Python or C#? No. However, I would imagine that the frameworks that UE4 gives developers to start with will be as clean and as easy to work with as whats in UE3 and that code will only get more messy as the coder lets it. If I remember correctly old UE1/2 C++ code that was made available for the Linux server ports was regarded as a great example of clean, easy to understand C++ code. C++11 especially has a lot of stuff to keep things clean and simple. No modern C++ programmer should really be farting around with memcopy's and naked pointers anymore. Then there is the argument for all the wonderful tools surrounding C++ development. They are generations beyond what Unrealscript has.

Although I was just getting myself embedded in UDK coding, I'm kinda happy to see this happen. It will hurt people who have invested into this niche language but will probably make the engine more approachable (by programmers) as a whole and certainly provide welcome changes for professional developers. On the opposite end it will surely be more difficult for someone who knows nothing about programming and wants to start programming UDK games, but in the end learning C++ will be a far more transferable skill than a knowledge of UnrealScript will be. There will certainly be more books and references to help them!

Finally those of you invested in UnrealScript will still have a leg up. I'd be very surprised to find the theoretical foundations, the ideas of PlayerControllers, Pawns, Actors, etc. to be very different from what they are now. Knowing this structural layout is half the battle and will aid you greatly. In many ways you will be ahead of a C++ programmer coming to unreal for the first time.

[Eliot]

I wonder what will happen to the convenience of the ReplicationBlock, I know how it's done in C++ at the moment with NativeReplication, but this isn't exactly convenient. Even though the C++ way is definitely better performance wise, it's quite ugly and harder to understand. Can't wait to see epic's solution to this.

And obviously the same goes for States, DefaultProperties and the hundreds of specifiers.

[reinrag]

I Think epic will not just throw an engine without making it easy for developpers they never do that, it will be in c++ language but perhaps they'll create their own library something ( i ain't good when it comes to c++) so correction is welcome

[mikepurvis]

I read that modifying the C++ code under Kismet will not require compiling, doesn't that mean it will just be C++ syntax but it's actually being used as a scripting language that will run on the engine like in a virtual machine?

[Sly.]

I read that modifying the C++ code under Kismet will not require compiling

Maybe they meant that one can change certain variables in code through Kismet? I have a hard time imagining changing huge parts of the code structure with Kismet but we'll see.

[Rogdor]

I absolutely love UnrealScript, so of course this sounds like disappointing news, but I'm not all that worried for three reasons:

1. I'm assuming that Epic will provide similar functionality as an API or (as others are guessing) C++ syntax scripting.

2. It's still a long ways off most likely. They've only just officially announced UE4, which will probably roll out to select full licensees first, then trickle down to UDK. If my UDK project isn't off the ground by the time UE3 deprecates, I'll just have to adapt.

3. UE3 is still very capable and I feel has longer legs than previous version of the Unreal Engine or any other engine available right now. Even as it is, sooner or later I'll be picking a specific month release to stick with, because upgrading is sometimes disruptive.

I do really wish the dynamic lighting in UE3 would become improved though (dynamic shadows have so many comprises right now, with some features outright broken). For the stealth elements of my project that would benefit my gameplay greatly. Considering the dynamic lighting is such a big feature for UE4, I doubt they'll be patching UE3's lighting any further.

[lunatorra]

I havent actually started programming yet so I'm not sure how Actionscript fits into all this, but would I still be able to program stuff with it? Anyone know?

[Blade[UG]]

I don't believe anyone has said anything about supported subsystems such as Scaleform.

[seujose]

Guys, why the Epic does not speak officially about it?
Anyone can contact someone at Epic and confirm this information?
People should be warned. It has a lot of people studying Uscript (like me). We are wasting time? Still worth studying Uscript after all?
Dude, I'm pretty lost!