So can evading be fixed?

[Maaaaaz]

**Please bear in mind this thread is entirely conjecture. I put it forth as truth, but only because I 100% believe it lol. It does make sense, after all **

Sup yo.

Currently, when you evade, your hitbox does not update until you complete the roll. This leads to many, many deaths that should not have happened.

You know, when someone pops off your head with the gnasher even whilst you're diving away?
When someone throws an incend, you're already moving off but it still manages to hit you?

It's because, according to the game, you're still in that same spot until you hit the ground. Is it possible for this to actually be fixed? It really sucks when you accrue deaths which should never have occurred.

This also happens when sliding into cover.

I believe this is one of the reasons why the Mantle Kick is so broken as well. You know all of the times when you've dove away from the cover yet still get kicked? It's cus your hitbox is still in cover, causing you to get kicked midroll.

I think I know what's going on. The roll changes your player state (explains the "supeman headshot death while standing still" paradox) while leaving your hitbox where the roll originated from. The order of events goes like this:

1. Press the evade button to evade.
2. Change your state to evading. (next frame, about 33 ms)
3. Evade. (takes a couple seconds)
4. End the evade. (probably 1 frame also)
5. Change the state back to the default state
6. Update your hitbox.

Having a lethal grenade (any type) thrown at you between steps 2 and 6 exposes this problem. This is a windows of about 2-3 seconds (maybe more, I don't have a stopwatch or a functioning copy of GOW3 anymore). This makes frags and incendiary grenades kill you when you moved, and inks stun you too. Lag and CSHD also play a part in this and make it worse than it already is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l2Bwik9jab0

it's called "evading" so why doesn't it evade anything?

[Golden RAAM]

Isn't this connection related when evade doesn't evade proberly? But yes it is annoying to get popped while rolling.

[ValeraPitiesDaFool]

I've popped someone head while they were evading but I was still aiming at their head when they weren't. So it's like the floor smashed their head open.

[kyoto771]

one of the biggest gameplay issues with GoW3 since release...and still no word from Epic.

It's stupid that its safer to walk away from a gnasher shot or a frag than it is to roll away. ITS CALLED A DODGE ROLL FOR A REASON!....yet it doesn't dodge anything

[Maaaaaz]

Have you tested this with a friend or is this based off of an experience you had?

Seen many, many people who have brought this issue up before.
I've experienced it so many times, lol. Especially the incendiaries. They're the worst culprit of this, imo.
And planted frags. Don't forget them.

It's stupid that its safer to walk away from a gnasher shot or a frag than it is to roll away. ITS CALLED A DODGE ROLL FOR A REASON!....yet it doesn't dodge anything

This, a million times this lol. You might as well just stand still for all the good it does.

[Golden RAAM]

This, a million times this lol. You might as well just stand still for all the good it does.

Lol agreed, once i hear the beep beep i cease movement because i know it aint gonna work.

[123MAN]

Yeah. Imagine how amazing battles would look in this game if it worked properly. It would look majestic.

[ValeraPitiesDaFool]

I can understand frags killing you when your evading. Think about it. You stick your legs out when your jump forwards/backwards/sideways.

[Maaaaaz]

Lol agreed, once i hear the beep beep i cease movement because i know it aint gonna work.

Mhm, took a while to stop my reflexes smashing the X button to dive away, but I finally accepted it haha.

Yeah. Imagine how amazing battles would look in this game if it worked properly. It would look majestic.

Hey, I think someone mantling cover and kicking 4 people who aren't even near the cover is very majestic!

I can understand frags killing you when your evading. Think about it. You stick your legs out when your jump forwards/backwards/sideways.

Not when you've dived behind a wall lol, like the Thrashball tunnel.

[ValeraPitiesDaFool]

Mhm, took a while to stop my reflexes smashing the X button to dive away, but I finally accepted it haha.



Hey, I think someone mantling cover and kicking 4 people who aren't even near the cover is very majestic!



Not when you've dived behind a wall lol, like the Thrashball tunnel.

Isn't that a Frag problem then? :]

[Maaaaaz]

Isn't that a Frag problem then? :][QUOTE]

I think if the hitbox instantly updated, the frags would not seem so much of a problem lol.

[ValeraPitiesDaFool]

[QUOTE=Maaaaaz;30241602]Isn't that a Frag problem then? :]

I think if the hitbox instantly updated, the frags would not seem so much of a problem lol.

I see your point.

[123MAN]

Mhm, took a while to stop my reflexes smashing the X button to dive away, but I finally accepted it haha.



Hey, I think someone mantling cover and kicking 4 people who aren't even near the cover is very majestic!



Not when you've dived behind a wall lol, like the Thrashball tunnel.

Think about it though if everything did work perfectly. This game would be the absolutely amazing.

[joal0503]

ive always understood it like this...evading/rolling is a tactic that should be reserved for actually evading...rolling into shotgun blast is death...and KILLING opponents who are rolling is incredibly easy. essentially, most good player know that rolling isnt a good idea around a shotgun battle, and these 'deaths that shouldnt have happened' SHOULD happen. I cant recall having issues, or noticing any major hitbox errors associated with the roll../

[Maaaaaz]

Think about it though if everything did work perfectly. This game would be the absolutely amazing.

So much more so than currently.

ive always understood it like this...evading/rolling is a tactic that should be reserved for actually evading...rolling into shotgun blast is death...and KILLING opponents who are rolling is incredibly easy. essentially, most good player know that rolling isnt a good idea around a shotgun battle, and these 'deaths that shouldnt have happened' SHOULD happen. I cant recall having issues, or noticing any major hitbox errors associated with the roll../

I find evading can often throw an opponent off. Most times I'm forced to due to not being near cover and several people are coming.
But it's planted frags and thrown incends where you'll see this most. Times when you pre-emptively rolled away but they still get you.

[kyoto771]

I wish Epic would just fix it already. It really does affect a lot of the online gameplay.

Gears 1 and 2 didn't have this issue....why does the most polished Gears game do?

[Maaaaaz]

I wish Epic would just fix it already. It really does affect a lot of the online gameplay.

Gears 1 and 2 didn't have this issue....why does the most polished Gears game do?

The irony is, in fixing problems the previous 2 games had, they actually made issues in this one

[Golden RAAM]

The irony is, in fixing problems the previous 2 games had, they actually made issues in this one

The issue of my issue... is my friend

[kyoto771]

most good player know that rolling isnt a good idea around a shotgun battle, and these 'deaths that shouldnt have happened' SHOULD happen

sure rolling isn't the smartest thing to do in a shotty battle, but that doesn't mean a missed shot should kill you.

I cant recall having issues, or noticing any major hitbox errors associated with the roll../

so shooting at thin air in front of you when the enemy is already behind you and still getting the kill isn't an issue? or rolling behind cover and getting blown up by a frag that is on the opposite side of the cover isn't an issue?

i don't think you fully understand what we're talking about here. please refrain from saying there isn't a problem when there clearly is one

[Maaaaaz]

The issue of my issue... is my friend

Too right haha.

[joal0503]

sure rolling isn't the smartest thing to do in a shotty battle, but that doesn't mean a missed shot should kill you.




so shooting at thin air in front of you when the enemy is already behind you and still getting the kill isn't an issue? or rolling behind cover and getting blown up by a frag that is on the opposite side of the cover isn't an issue?

i don't think you fully understand what we're talking about here. please refrain from saying there isn't a problem when there clearly is one

okay. im not sayin it doesnt exist for some folks. just stating my own experience. I guess, isnt this just a lag related issue ? Not some hitbox code error?

[Maaaaaz]

okay. im not sayin it doesnt exist for some folks. just stating my own experience. I guess, isnt this just a lag related issue ? Not some hitbox code error?

I think it's to do with CSHD. The client doesn't register your change in movement until you hit the ground.

Have you never been killed by an incendiary mid roll and wondered how it managed to kill you?

[joal0503]

yea, im totally on board with that idea...definitely seen some goofy registration/animations with frag proximity/mid roll...but nothing really that consistent. More times I feel like damn yea i was too close...As far as incendiary, arent they suppose to stop you mid roll?

[Andy157]

Sup yo.

Currently, when you evade, your hitbox does not update until you complete the roll. This leads to many, many deaths that should not have happened.

You know, when someone pops off your head with the gnasher even whilst you're diving away?
When someone throws an incend, you're already moving off but it still manages to hit you?

It's because, according to the game, you're still in that same spot until you hit the ground. Is it possible for this to actually be fixed? It really sucks when you accrue deaths which should never have occurred.

GOOD THREAD OP, this happens to me about every time I play, ussually with a grenade but also with shotguns and diggers, boomers etc.. the hit box is not reading right from the start of the roll. I will clearly be no where near the explosion but I will still blow up.

[kyoto771]

okay. im not sayin it doesnt exist for some folks. just stating my own experience. I guess, isnt this just a lag related issue ? Not some hitbox code error?

it happens to everyone on GoW3, as it is how the roll mechanic was coded. It has nothing to do with lag.

[Maaaaaz]

yea, im totally on board with that idea...definitely seen some goofy registration/animations with frag proximity/mid roll...but nothing really that consistent. More times I feel like damn yea i was too close...As far as incendiary, arent they suppose to stop you mid roll?

When I say midroll, I meant when they throw it where you were standing, and you're already in the air moving away from it, but it still manages to get you.

GOOD THREAD OP, this happens to me about every time I play, ussually with a grenade but also with shotguns and diggers, boomers etc.. the hit box is not reading right from the start of the roll. I will clearly be no where near the explosion but I will still blow up.

Thanks

I don't notice it too much with the digger- poor thing is so weak it has to pop out of the ground and up your ass for it to kill you.
But yeah, with everything else it's horrible

[Fart]

They probably changed it to avoid the exploit of avoiding death by frags by diving shortly before nades went off in previous gears games.

[Maaaaaz]

They probably changed it to avoid the exploit of avoiding death by frags by diving shortly before nades went off in previous gears games.

But that made sense though. If they knew the frag was there, and it was in a place like Blood Drive where there is no other way to go around, you could risk running in then diving out again.
Besides, why remove this ability and then make smokes blow up nades?

[kyoto771]

They probably changed it to avoid the exploit of avoiding death by frags by diving shortly before nades went off in previous gears games.

how is that an exploit? it's simply getting out the way of an explosion, and no, if you're still withing blast radius while mid-roll...it still kills you in the previous games.

besides the nades in GoW3 have more range

[Maaaaaz]

besides the nades in GoW3 have more range

Definitely seems so lol.

[NP473L]

This problem is getting very annoying now to me...

...thread supported

[Maaaaaz]

This problem is getting very annoying now to me...

...thread supported

Thanks .

[HRPac]

how is that an exploit? it's simply getting out the way of an explosion, and no, if you're still withing blast radius while mid-roll...it still kills you in the previous games.

besides the mini-nukes in GoW3 have more range

fixed ^^^. good topic for discussion TC. i've had games where the hit registers as it should but also many instances where I had evaded (with plenty of time to spare) and still managed to die. i just want it to be consistent either way.

[Gnasher4Life]

So annoying when this happens

[Maaaaaz]

fixed ^^^. good topic for discussion TC. i've had games where the hit registers as it should but also many instances where I had evaded (with plenty of time to spare) and still managed to die. i just want it to be consistent either way.

TC=Threat Creator?

Yeah, the lack of consistency is horrible. If this game was 100% consistent, then it would drastically improve.

[Tysodie]

TC=Threat Creator?

Yeah, the lack of consistency is horrible. If this game was 100% consistent, then it would drastically improve.

I think TC stood for thread creator

[HRPac]

a little old school but yes, TC = Thread Creator

[Maaaaaz]

I think TC stood for thread creator

a little old school but yes, TC = Thread Creator

My deduction skills prevailed

[Tysodie]

My deduction skills prevailed

You put threat creator though........

[Fart]

how is that an exploit? it's simply getting out the way of an explosion, and no, if you're still withing blast radius while mid-roll...it still kills you in the previous games.

besides the nades in GoW3 have more range

You could avoid dying to frags that were right at your feet with it. You'd go full red when you should have been fragged. Def an exploit