Myth and Facts about the Sawed-Off

[hellaeric09]

Before I start, I would like to first say that this thread is NOT:
-Intended to be an attack on hardcore Gnasher users (though I'm sure some people will take it that way)
-A trolling thread (though I'm sure some people will take it that way)
-A thread detailing how the SO is better than the Gnasher
-An "adapt" thread (I used to hate those as usually the people who said it actually weren't very good)
-An attempt to convert those comfortable with the Gnasher or who want to learn to be confortable with the Gnasher to the SO (as I believe you need to learn to use both to be successful)
-For those who didn't take the time out to read it because it was too long, and want to advertise their laziness/illiteracy with "tl/dr (10 char)" (but do commentas every comment bumps this thread to the front page)

This thread is :
-Intended for those who aren't comfortable with the Gnasher but don't want to switch for fear of being seen as a noob
-For people who already use the SO and are good with it, but feel they must "upgrade" to the Gnasher
-For people who blindly look down on SO users based on other people's opinions
-For people that are ashamed for using the SO
-An attempt to validate the SO playstyle to the aforementioned parties by derailing common myths associated with the gun

And now that that's taken care of, let's get started...

The SO is only used for and by corner campers.

As a corner camping tool, despite the wide spread, the SO very ineffective at corner camping due to its longer reload time and shorter range. The optimum loadout for the corner camper is Gnasher/Retro as both are very effetive at holding a corner, especially against smarter, more aware opponents, while the Gnasher is still as effective at taking out the less aware opponents that round the corner.

People who use the SO do so because it doesn't require aiming/skill.

I put these two together because they are often lumped together by those that perpetuate this myth. Despite the wide angle of effectiveness, the SO does require a significant amount of aiming. However, unlike the Gnasher, the SO presents a unique challenge as the effective range of the gun starves the user of the luxury of hardaiming. While the Gnasher is harder to aim, missing with the Gnasher is not penalized as hard as missing with the SO. In addition, the Gnasher isn't exactly a sniper rifle, and is blind-aimed in the exact same way as the SO in close-range combat. As for skill, most of the skills a skilled Gnasher users needs are very necessary for the SO, especially when going against Gnasher users and other SO users which leads me to my next myth:

SO users don't/can't wallbounce, use cover, and/or generally maneuver as well as a Gnasher user.

I personally love this myth, because I like the surprise that Gnasher users get when they discover I wallbounce just as well as they do. Due to the hit-and-run playstyle of the SO, it is required that in order to get away to live to fire another shot when dealing with a skilled Gnasher user or even another skilled SO user, one must be able to dodge their opponent's (or opponents') shots for the time it takes to reload their gun (and possibly to get back in range). I found my wallbouncing and dodging skills got better when using the SO.

There is no such thing as a SO duel.

Because of the long reload time, teammates with other weapons, the man-up rule, scarcity of ammo for the gun, scarcity of SO players, the long reload time, and the general playstyle of the SO, among other things, SO duels generally don't happen. That doesn't mean one isn't impossible, though, but they are very rare. I've only gotten into one that I could remember and I've been playing since around October (not counting the beta). I'm willing to be in one, but usually, like other SO users, I just pull out my AR, which bring me to my next point:

SO users all use the Retro Lancer because both guns require no aiming.

We already discussed the aiming myth for the SO, and this isn't a debate about Retro Lancer myths. The Retro Lancer is actually a great companion to the SO style of gameplay as it heavily involves fighting Gnasher users in their peak range. Without going deep into SO tactics against Gnasher users, the power of the gun along with the spread and the Retro Charge are great tools in turning the tables on a Gnasher users. Of course, there are occasionally times where the long range of the Hammerburst, or the infinite clip and chainsaw on the Lancer are preferred, and a good SO user does switch accordingly. I'm sure there will even be SO users in the posts after this one who prefer using the Lancer or the Hammerburst as opposed to the Retro.

The SO is for noobs to get used to the feeling of Gears. It's the equivalent of training wheels.

This one is actually very tricky since Rod Ferguson released this statement in the Gears 3 Q&A:
"We recognize people really like the shotgun gameplay so we wanted to find a way to let new players have that same experience who aren't talented with the Gnasher for example. So we wanted to make a weapon that doesn't require the twitch gameplay of the Gnasher but allows them to have that close quarters combat fun. I know it's a controversial weapon. "
This is interpreted by Gnasher enthusiasts as "the Sawed-off is for noobs who can't cut it with the Gnasher" insead of how it should be intrepreted, "the Sawed-off is an alternate weapon designed for people who just don't want to learn how to use the Gnasher." The SO is supposed to be to the Gnasher what the Hammerburst is to the Lancer, which is an alternate loadout option. Just as you don't use the Hammerburst to get better at the Lancer, you don't use the SO to get better at the Gnasher, or even at Gears of War. You use it because it's better at extremely close ranges than the Gnasher is, and that's the intention. In fact, Lee Perry explained the range capabilities of the weapons as:
Sawed-Off → Gnasher → Retro Lancer → Lancer → Hammerburst
If the Sawed-Off was supposed to be a dumbed-down version of the Gnasher, it wouldn't have its own range. In fact, if it was supposed to be just for newbies,then why is it usable outside of Casual Mode, a mode literally created for players level 10 and below (a.k.a. newbies)? And why is it easy to hardaim down a SOuser with the Gnasher before they could even get to you (if you hit them at the proper range, of course)? Why is it that Gears vets can even use the SO? Of course, this is a very controversial area, but looking at those questions should make you think.

The SO is a hard-counter to the Gnasher.

This is actually partially correct. The SO is a hard-counter to the Gnasher...at its proper range. Any skilled Gnasher user worth his/her rank will tell you the Gnasher has no problem with the DBS, as long as you are aware of the range and capabilities of the gun. If you treat the DBS user like you treat another Gnasher user, you will find yourself splattered on very wall you bounced off. However, if the DBS user goes charging in, a Gnasher will have no problem hardaiming the **** out of him/her. All the weapons in this game are balanced by range, and which weapon is best to use at what time is determined by how far the target is away from you. That's why a Retro Lancer can beat a Hammerburst at close range, but the further away you get, the greater the advantage is for the Hammerburst.

I hope this post was at least informative for those planning on using the Sawed-Off or who already do. I would like to restate that it is not my intention to turn anyone off from using the Gnasher or berate any hardcore Gnasher fan, but instead that this post made you accept our Gears who prefer the SO and the playstyle that goes along with it. Of course, if you didn't, I don't ****ing care

[Fishead John]

This thread is the King of Sawn Off Threads.


Agree on all points but I still say the SOS has been nerfed to the point that its basically the TF of Gears 3. In most cases in the hands of the playerbase I'd say I got 400 gold that says its worthless.

[SaintPocc]

"missing with the Gnasher is not penalized as hard as missing with the Gnasher"

- hellaeric09

[Siamese Dream]

Very nice post. I read the entire thing and I thoroughly agree with everything you've said. Honestly, the sawed off and rifles have changed the game for the better. The gnasher is fun yes, but it is idolised too much in the gears community. The sawed off and stronger rifles give the game more variety, more challenge, more tactic and for me atleast, make the game more fun. Frustrating at times, but fun. You gave your opinion in a respectful and clear way. Nicely done.

[E.P.I.C. Lizard]

Agree on most of it. I will never swap out my gnasher with the SO, i would rather have the follow up shots, especially since i play alot of koth. I think overall the weapons are well balanced and each play an important role in certain scenarios.

[SKORGE]

Personally, I feel like a lot of these points were sugar-coated with a positive SoS-based spin in order to present a one-sided argument in favor of the tactics employed by SoS users and the gun itself. To me, it boils down to this. If the Gnasher is restricted to CQC and so is the SoS ... you'll eventually have to come to terms with the fact that the two weapons will always clash in such a scenario. However, the problem is that while you must aim and actually place your shots with the Gnasher, with the SoS you have a cone-of-death. And so, you not only overshadow the role of the Gnasher as a CQC weapon with the sheer fact that the SoS can do more damage to more people with one shot that requires little aiming, but you also bring into question the legitimacy of having the SoS as a true skill based weapon. Was it your skill that gave you the kill or was it the cone-of-death?

... after all, the Gnasher isn't a sniper and therefor cannot be used outside of a "Gnasher-scenario" aka CQC. Therefor, how is one to deal with a SoS in such a situation?

[AJ Crawford]

People don't complain about corner camping with holding the corner in mind. They're usually talking about someone waiting around a corner with the SO... BAM! ... RUN AWAY!

[Gears of Wario]

Yeah, love this thread.
Still agitates me people complain about the gun lol

In my honest opinion, I find the SO more fun & challenging to use than a Gnasher.

[GoodButNotAsFamous]

Most of these are obvious true or false statements and didn't need an explanation but other than that I agree.

[AJ Crawford]

Yeah, love this thread.
Still agitates me people complain about the gun lol

In my honest opinion, I find the SO more fun & challenging to use than a Gnasher.

... really? Don't get me wrong... I love to pick up the SO from time to time. It is fun to pull the trigger and feel like you just blasted some mofo with a cannon. But more challenging to use? You be trippin'.

[Gears of Wario]

... really? Don't get me wrong... I love to pick up the SO from time to time. It is fun to pull the trigger and feel like you just blasted some mofo with a cannon. But more challenging to use? You be trippin'.

I believe so. I the Gnasher has 8+ feet more range than the SO, and SO users get punished if they miss or there are two people.

[Fishead John]

... really? Don't get me wrong... I love to pick up the SO from time to time. It is fun to pull the trigger and feel like you just blasted some mofo with a cannon. But more challenging to use? You be trippin'.

Pre-nerf I'd agree with you to an extent. Post-nerf you have to be the one whos tripping. The Gnasher is beyond easy to rack up kills with in comparison to the SOS. It's more of a challenge to get anywhere near the numbers of kills with such limited ammunition capacity. Where as you can bleed the Gnasher dry and and atleast have a kill for every 2-3 shots in one life.

[AJ Crawford]

Pre-nerf I'd agree with you to an extent. Post-nerf you have to be the one whos tripping. The Gnasher is beyond easy to rack up kills with in comparison to the SOS. It's more of a challenge to get anywhere near the numbers of kills with such limited ammunition capacity. Where as you can bleed the Gnasher dry and and atleast have a kill for every 2-3 shots in one life.

Capacity has nothing to do with it, though. We're talking which is the more challenging weapon to use, not which will get you the most kills. The Gnasher requires you to aim, to be accurate. The SO requires you to have someone in front while you pull the trigger.

[DenyThisFlesh]

While most of the OP is true, the Sawed-Off will always be treated as a noob weapon due to being designed that way. It's definitely more difficult to use now than it was originally, but it's still pretty easy to use and doesn't require anywhere near the same accuracy as the Gnasher. That being said, I don't have a problem with people using it. It's easily countered by every other starting weapon.

[Gears of Wario]

Capacity has nothing to do with it, though. We're talking which is the more challenging weapon to use, not which will get you the most kills. The Gnasher requires you to aim, to be accurate. The SO requires you to have someone in front while you pull the trigger.

Re-post:

I believe so. The Gnasher has 8+ feet more range than the SO, and SO users get punished if they miss or there are two people.

And since when do you need to aim with the Gnasher?

[AJ Crawford]

Re-post:




And since when do you need to aim with the Gnasher?

Since forever? Even firing from the hip requires you to aim if you want any chance of getting a kill.

I believe so. I the Gnasher has 8+ feet more range than the SO, and SO users get punished if they miss or there are two people.

Range shouldn't come into it if you're using the SO properly. You're getting in close on unsuspecting victims and blasting them for an easy kill - however you spin it there is nothing challenging about that. I'll agree that using the SO and surviving on a regular basis requires a certain level of competency.

[Gears of Wario]

Since forever? Even firing from the hip requires you to aim if you want any chance of getting a kill.

Lol oh okay I see what you mean. I thought you meant LT aiming.

[TerrorTwilight]

Anyone who likes this thread, please go back to Halo/COD please! Thanks in advance!

[Gears of Wario]

Anyone who likes this thread, please go back to Halo/COD please! Thanks in advance!

Nice way to contribute to the topic bro!

/sarcasm

[Leech Zombie]

SOS... noobcannon. Deal with it.

[x Death Anxiety]

Scumbag SoS user, has 5 years to adapt to gnasher, tells us to adapt to SoS

[Leech Zombie]

Scumbag SoS user, has 5 years to adapt to gnasher, tells us to adapt to SoS

They just don't seem to understand this rebuttal, ever..

which is why i take someone on with the SoS, i will always (Y) execute him with my snub, regardless if it will kill me.

[x Death Anxiety]

They just don't seem to understand this rebuttal, ever..

which is why i take someone on with the SoS, i will always (Y) execute him with my snub, regardless if it will kill me.

I do the same, finally something we agree on leech

[iGoDz II DraGon]

Ewwww, Sawed-Off.

The reason I've prestiged twice on Assassin's Creed.

[Leech Zombie]

I do the same, finally something we agree on leech

Brought together by a common enemy.

[SKORGE]

Ewwww, Sawed-Off.

The reason I've prestiged twice on Assassin's Creed.

Revelations?

[Phantom of Chaos]

SO takes SOME skill...Its an all or nothing gun, where if u missed, ur history, and with the gnasher....
Well, i just think people who think gears was bred by the gnasher are real idiots, although the gnasher IS a good weapon

[iGoDz II DraGon]

Revelations?

Yessir .

[Leech Zombie]

SO takes SOME skill...Its an all or nothing gun, where if u missed, ur history, and with the gnasher....
Well, i just think people who think gears was bred by the gnasher are real idiots, although the gnasher IS a good weapon

Bud Gears is what it is today because of the Gnasher.... It wasn't an amazing game because you sat in cover and rifled people down, its because you ran it, tucked your head and hoped to hell you get the first shot with the Gnasher.. obvious 48 posts shows you don't know what your talking about

[KAZ1980]

Scumbag SoS user, has 5 years to adapt to gnasher, tells us to adapt to SoS

THIIIIIS x10
You had FIVE years to adapt. Using the SOS over the Gnasher will always limit your potential in gears. I feel bad for people that use it, they can be so much better at this game... *sigh*

[x Death Anxiety]

SO takes SOME skill...Its an all or nothing gun, where if u missed, ur history, and with the gnasher....
Well, i just think people who think gears was bred by the gnasher are real idiots, although the gnasher IS a good weapon

Shhhh, have fun with your training wheels

[SKORGE]

Yessir .

Great game, very sexy. I wish for dat third one already.

I was real keen on playing through on AC:R MP but Gears drew me back in somehow... yeah... Gears... lol

[Leech Zombie]

Shhhh, have fun with your training wheels

Awhh why'd you go an expose the poor guy? ... oh wait no good job

[iGoDz II DraGon]

Great game, very sexy. I wish for dat third one already.

I was real keen on playing through on AC:R MP but Gears drew me back in somehow... yeah... Gears... lol

Have you played any AC:R multiplayer?

... Or Brotherhood..? I've hit 50 three times on Brotherhood.

[Xx Dantes Rage]

Personally, I feel like a lot of these points were sugar-coated with a positive SoS-based spin in order to present a one-sided argument in favor of the tactics employed by SoS users and the gun itself. To me, it boils down to this. If the Gnasher is restricted to CQC and so is the SoS ... you'll eventually have to come to terms with the fact that the two weapons will always clash in such a scenario. However, the problem is that while you must aim and actually place your shots with the Gnasher, with the SoS you have a cone-of-death. And so, you not only overshadow the role of the Gnasher as a CQC weapon with the sheer fact that the SoS can do more damage to more people with one shot that requires little aiming, but you also bring into question the legitimacy of having the SoS as a true skill based weapon. Was it your skill that gave you the kill or was it the cone-of-death?

... after all, the Gnasher isn't a sniper and therefor cannot be used outside of a "Gnasher-scenario" aka CQC. Therefor, how is one to deal with a SoS in such a situation?

^^^I Agree with all of this^^^

[SKORGE]

Have you played any AC:R multiplayer?

... Or Brotherhood..? I've hit 50 three times on Brotherhood.

Yes I have.

However, I do not always have the greatest of luck. For example, I was:

- attacked by a civilian (not a decoy but a true random civvie from a crowd) who was attacking my team and was punished for killing him.
- punished for jumping in after a civilian that looked just like my target and happened to run and hop into a haystack.

As for Brotherhood, I didn't get too far in that one as I was mostly going at AC:B for the SP. Online was fun but again, Gears two took most of my online gaming.

[iGoDz II DraGon]

Yes I have.

However, I do not always have the greatest of luck. For example, I was:

- attacked by a civilian (not a decoy but a true random civvie from a crowd) who was attacking my team and was punished for killing him.
- punished for jumping in after a civilian that looked just like my target and happened to run and hop into a haystack.

You were fooled twice by the Bodyguard.

Bodyguards are capable of stunning incoming pursuers, as well as jumping into haystacks.

Trust me, I've been fooled one too many times by both Bodyguards and Decoys.

[shoelessjoe234]

Look. The Sawed-off (Please stop saying Sawn, even if you aren't from the U.S. Gears was made in the U.S.) is a tool for a different game play style that was meant for new players or people who don't like/aren't good with the gnasher. End of argument.

" We recognize people really like the shotgun gameplay so we wanted to find a way to let new players have that same experience who aren't talented with the Gnasher for example. So we wanted to make a weapon that doesn't require the twitch gameplay of the Gnasher but allows them to have that close quarters combat fun. I know it's a controversial weapon. " - Rod Fergusson

[Pretty Deathly]

Sometimes I use it in hopes of annoying people. Sure works, hatemail galore.

[x Death Anxiety]

Look. The Sawed-off (Please stop saying Sawn, even if you aren't from the U.S. Gears was made in the U.S.) is a tool for a different game play style that was meant for new players or people who don't like/aren't good with the gnasher. End of argument.

" We recognize people really like the shotgun gameplay so we wanted to find a way to let new players have that same experience who aren't talented with the Gnasher, like me, for example. So we wanted to make a weapon that doesn't require the twitch gameplay of the Gnasher but allows them to have that close quarters combat fun. I know it's a controversial weapon. " - Rod Fergusson

Fixed
(10 fixeds)