DM-Angkoria [Beta] [V1.0 Updated 12/08/08]

[Kaburan31]

Name: DM-Angkoria
Version:Beta DM & TDM
Compatibility:PC
Description:You have been pitted into a battle over the small jungle valley of Angkoria, spilling blood and proving your skill is the only way to honor this ancient oriental shrine.

Comments:This is my first published map i've ever created, and would just like some feedback on the map. This has more or less been a huge learning experience for me, and I seek to improve on my future maps due to the inspiration I have found on many user submitted maps here. This is a beta release and I am aware of a lot of texture (seam) issues on my meshes as well as some gameplay issues so i've got plenty of Vaseline in hand for that. Either way your thoughts are highly appreciated and noted. Thanks and I hope you enjoy.

Version 1.0 Changes (12/08/08)
Thanks to several of you who have helped me I made the following changes and have locally tested it successfully!

1. Foliage no longer blocks weapons
2. Added dome collision
3. Smoothened terrain and added new gameplay meshes in the open riverbed.
4. Worked on lighting to improve realism and scene tone.
5. Improved waterfall effects

Beta v1 Screenshots:








Credits:My Lack of Sleep, and Everyone on Epic Forums who's helped me thus far.

Download:
http://wjkowach.net/Downloads/DM-Angkoria_betav1.zip

[Aaronius]

Looks awesome!


Downloading it right now


Thanks for sharing!

[Staward]

looks good, d'l'ing.

[Staward]

Just had a brief playthrough, what i can say is: Looks like the grass have collision set to BlockWep, you might want to change that, often i got my shots blocked by them. Also you might want to smoothen the terrain a bit, it's very sharp in some parts. Theres a small room with a dome above that has no collision, i got there by jumping from the rocky bridge. And a minor change would be setting up a better water material, as this one isn't two-sided.

[LtClifff]

Envrioment looks amazing! However the lighting needs some work. WIth good quality lighting this map would look ten times as good. Save another version of this map as lighting test and then add one pale orange directional light at a very steep angle, and another of the same colour at a sligtly softer angle but about half as bright. Then add a skylight half as bright as that one. The first light should have a brightness of about 1.4.

This should be your starting point for realistic lighting. From this, pootle around with different colours and brighnesses to see what sort of atmosphere you can achieve I reckon you could make this map quite something

[MasterB]

Great looking map.
Not much flow though. I got the feeling that everyone was just running around shooting. It would be good if you could setup some barriers that would force flow. Maybe raise some terrain?
Also the water flows straight into a rock wall. Maybe create a tunnel under the wall that the water would flow down into. This would make it more realistic.
Very nice first try. With some changes, this would be a nice map.

[Kaburan31]

Wow, thank you so much for taking the time to run my level through, and the feedback is awesome! All of the suggestions mentioned are on par!

---

Just had a brief playthrough, what i can say is: Looks like the grass have collision set to BlockWep, you might want to change that, often i got my shots blocked by them. Also you might want to smoothen the terrain a bit, it's very sharp in some parts. Theres a small room with a dome above that has no collision, i got there by jumping from the rocky bridge. And a minor change would be setting up a better water material, as this one isn't two-sided.

Thanks Staward, I need to definitely change the foliage to disallow weap collision. The terrain is very rough in some areas and I will go through and smoothen them out for ease of travel. Thanks for catching the dome with no collision i'll be sure to bring that in.

Envrioment looks amazing! However the lighting needs some work. WIth good quality lighting this map would look ten times as good. Save another version of this map as lighting test and then add one pale orange directional light at a very steep angle, and another of the same colour at a sligtly softer angle but about half as bright. Then add a skylight half as bright as that one. The first light should have a brightness of about 1.4.

This should be your starting point for realistic lighting. From this, pootle around with different colours and brighnesses to see what sort of atmosphere you can achieve I reckon you could make this map quite something

Wow thank you for this info! I am completely new to lighting in UT3 and aside from reading some tutorials I haven't had much to go by. I'll definitely work on the lighting, and then some!

Great looking map.
Not much flow though. I got the feeling that everyone was just running around shooting. It would be good if you could setup some barriers that would force flow. Maybe raise some terrain?
Also the water flows straight into a rock wall. Maybe create a tunnel under the wall that the water would flow down into. This would make it more realistic.
Very nice first try. With some changes, this would be a nice map.

MasterB, this is where i'm stuck. Working on this had caught me so much on visuals that I lost track of my papermap so it feels very open and chaotic. I would really like some ideas on what I can do here, if you guys have any ideas on what I can do in the middle terrain area for forced pathing, I would appreciate that. Otherwise thank you, i'll continue to work on this.

[Kaburan31]

Also does anyone have any good tutorials or can suggest me some ideas on how to create a realistic waterfall? I know splashes at the bottom are done with particle effects, but as for the actual waterfall...im stumped.

I looked at War-Tropico by Neoduck, and his water setups look amazing. I don't know how he did it

[MasterB]

Also does anyone have any good tutorials or can suggest me some ideas on how to create a realistic waterfall? I know splashes at the bottom are done with particle effects, but as for the actual waterfall...im stumped.

I looked at War-Tropico by Neoduck, and his water setups look amazing. I don't know how he did it

Try to PM "Odedge". He can be of help with tutorials and stuff.

IMO:
I would raise the terrain in the flat areas to hide players that are traveling on the paths. 1 or 2 high areas in the center of the map (like a large hills) would be good to work around. 1 large hill with a a cave through works well to hide players and makes the map feel larger than it is is.
Basically, I think you need to make the flat area much more hilly and work paths around the hills.
I would also do something with the back side of that museum platform. When on top, I would add concrete steps running down. The drop off looks unfinished.

[Odedge]

Try to PM "Odedge". He can be of help with tutorials and stuff.

Most waterfalls consist of a SM (with the appropriate material), and two emitters. You can borrow this setup from DM-Gateway (in the terrain part of the map) as I did for DM-Tomac. You may need to tweak the drawscale of of the mesh so it curves properlly over you rocks/terrain.

I haven't played WAR-Tropico, but Neoduck is definately a talented mapper. You should see how he did it. There is nothing wrong with learning from other's maps by looking at them in the editor. BUT, if he used custom content (materials/meshes/ect), you should not use them without permission (unless this is stated in their ReadMe).

I will take a look at the map and give you my feedback, I like mappers with your attitude, it makes beta testing them worth it.

Edit:

There is a issue with your map that doesn't really let me beta test it properlly. You have your major static meshs (buildings/skyboxes) set to only be displayed at higher world detail settings (I am using 3, when I use 4-5, it freaks out my video card (cooling issue I need to fix)). That being said, ALL of your major geometry/assets that will effect gameplay have to be set to the low setting. With out the skybox being displayed, I get a major Hall of Mirrors happening above your map (as it's looking out into the "Void").

The stuff you should set to higher world settings are small stuff that won't impact gameplay (grass, foliage, etc). Also keep in mind that if the mesh casts a shadow and the actual mesh isn't being displayed, it will look odd.

I have more suggestion, but would like to be able to take more time to look for them, I can't do that now. Will wait for an updated version.

[Kaburan31]

Thanks for the feedback Odedge, really appreciate the time you took to make notes. Thank you for clearing up the objects world detail, my static meshes were all set to High, so thats probably why i'm having that issue. I wasn't having it a problem here, but was happening when I tested on some computers at school and at my friends place.

I'll correct this issue as well and thanks for the waterfall info! Cheers.

[Odedge]

Thanks for the feedback Odedge, really appreciate the time you took to make notes. Thank you for clearing up the objects world detail, my static meshes were all set to High, so thats probably why i'm having that issue. I wasn't having it a problem here, but was happening when I tested on some computers at school and at my friends place.

I'll correct this issue as well and thanks for the waterfall info! Cheers.

No problem. It's always a good idea to test your map in the highest and lowest world details just to make sure what it looks like.

[Dopemgs]

Well I tested it and liked it.It kinda resembles an awesome map in UT2k4 and it was fun.But I'm afraid there were many flaws.The waterfall had a problem where the water collides with the rocks.The whole terrain was made a bit badly so it was tough to maneuver around.Dodging was kinda impossible so off with Godlike bots.But nevertheless it was really fun playing it.I'd love to play this on multi but I'm afraid that atm it's too unsmooth.Oh and do the lightning part a post before me said-I think it'd be amazing.The whole scenery is so romantic that after playing a real DM I player solo while admiring the terrain.Great job!It has atmosphere!

[Kaburan31]

Thanks Dopemgs, appreciate your feedback for sure. The gameplay was a lost factor for me, however with the suggestions mentioned by the community, I began to re-focus on gameplay and the terrain for better playability and movement.

Needless to say, the suggestions have been a HUGE help. You guys are frikken awesome and i'd like to high five everyone. Or at least buy a beer for every swingin' richard here. Very motivating.

I'm about to release the new beta version, and everyone who has put in some comment or suggestion one way or another will definitely see how "you all" have changed my map. In a most positive direction, at that. I am very pleased with the help. Cheers.

[Kaburan31]

Just another quick thanks to you guys.

Feel free to re download the new version, and check it out. Here are the changes (thanks to you guys!)
Screenshots and the new download are available at the Opening Post.

1. Foliage no longer blocks weapons
2. Added dome collision
3. Smoothened terrain and added new gameplay meshes in the open riverbed.
4. Worked on lighting to improve realism and scene tone.
5. Improved waterfall effects

[SEBASTIEN-NOVA]

Eh, looks nice !
I DL it and I'll take a look this evening...
I'll Post feedbacks later

[Dopemgs]

There should be more ppl like you,you know?
The map has expanded from beautiful scenery but weak gameplay to almost perfect scenery and GREAT gaming!The terrain is smoother now and it's so easy to maneuver around,to dodge,to double jump to all sorts of necessary items etc. I just have to say great job man.I love the way you've turned the map from something like a 6/10 to a 9/10! Everything we talked to you about is almost cleared and I'm sure the rest of the testers are gonna love it.Gonna test it in multiplayer soon too.
But it has a few problems like sometimes the water just slows the gameplay so if it doesn't trouble you maybe you should lower the amount of water on the whole terrain.There were moments where after a dodge I was almost crawling because of the water and it kinda ruined the dinamic gameplay.
too many vials.You can just dodge onto vials most of the time.
There are still many edges but they're only visual-not game affecting.If you clear them out I think this map will surely win awards in beauty contests.The atmosphere is wonderful.
I think you should add some nice tribal-like music.It would suit the game.
Oh one last thing-there is an alter-like-thingy in the game which kinda ruins it a bit because it's not exactly a wonderful cover,it's too easy to go there and hide until someone comes and kills/gets killed you/by you and it kinda ruins the gameplay.
There is a bridge which is too narrow and sometimes movement there gets hindered.

These are all the faults I've found in the map.Great job!Keep working on it for as it seems you are a hard-working fellow who respects the community-unlike most map-makers nowadays.Keep up the good work!!!

[Kaburan31]

Thanks Dope

I really appreciate you taking the time to comment and continue to make these honest recommendations.

I'm compiling a list of changes for my final polished level, and have uncovered some bugs, areas players get stuck etc. I will continue to work on the gameflow (its so hard with all these damn static meshes, I wanted the level to look beautiful foremost, which I understand have got my priorities backwards). As for the water, I understand how it slows things down. I will indeed lower the water a bit, and add some areas in the open water spaces in which players can jump around on and keep moving. Playing the level with what you had brought in mind definitely made me notice.

I also see what you're saying about the altar, I will construct something to swap out for the altar and add a better element.

Thanks a ton for your feedback.

I hope you guys will download my map come full release as i've worked hard on it and would feel very accomplished to see it on someones rotation. Thanks again!

[Odedge]

I have more suggestion, but would like to be able to take more time to look for them, I can't do that now. Will wait for an updated version.

Is it odd that I quoted myself? Any ways, with the updated version and some free time, I was able to go through it and here is my feedback. It's a 11MB pdf file, with pictures. (this guy likes pictures)

If you have any comments or questions on what I typed, let me know.

[Kaburan31]

Wow Odedge, that was some amazing testing and feedback you put together. Very nice! I hope you enjoyed ripping me apart on this run, because come final release you won't see the same issues (hopefully). Saving the PDF, thanks so much.

I also need to look at how to save all my packages into the map package. Is it too late since I already have all my static meshes placed into a separate external package??

Thanks a ton Odedge, even though this is my first attempt, I really am glad I could get this kind of detailed crit's. I take it very positively. Outstanding and Cheers.

Edited (Glad I brought my Vaseline)

[Odedge]

Wow Odedge, that was some amazing testing and feedback you put together. Very nice! I hope you enjoyed ripping me apart on this run, because come final release you won't see the same issues (hopefully). Saving the PDF, thanks so much.

LOL... Well, I didn't have fun ripping you apart, but providing usefull (hopefully) feedback wasn't so bad. If your map is better for it come final release, it will be worth it for I plan to keep your final version on my hard drive. Don't dissapoint!

I also need to look at how to save all my packages into the map package. Is it too late since I already have all my static meshes placed into a separate external package??

Check out post 28 on this page for a possible easier way. I haven't needed to do this, but it's worth a shot.

Thanks a ton Odedge, even though this is my first attempt, I really am glad I could get this kind of detailed crit's. I take it very positively. Outstanding and Cheers.

Edited (Glad I brought my Vaseline)

LOL. If my comments are at least recived well (meaning you consider them), that's all I can ask for. Hopefully you will implement the good ones! You're map has a good foundation, you just need to polish it up, though I don't think your Vaseline will do the job.... you must have just read the pdf file...

[SEBASTIEN-NOVA]

Just make a round on it :

As for the gamplay :
On the version I have tested (don't know wich is cause the map name have no sufix ) I think there are to much sames weapons available, in a map of this size, one weaponbase of each is enough.
More generally, items placement have to be re-though along an intuitive way (also named flow) all around the map.
The temple is a kind of dead end, not really good I think.
The movements inside is very difficult/slow on some places caused by collision with many objects or terrain itself.
The weapons on the water is not a good idea too.

As the visual :
you have put in some place water which casts rocks (on the center) but without source for it, it's make no sence.
The lighting need to be rework with more contraste and shadow to increase to visual potentiel of your nice environement
Also some textures too stretch on terrain/meshes.

To sum up, still works on it but a good start

[Kaburan31]

Hey guys,
Thanks for the feedback, and I have made many changes appropriately according to the recommendations. Thanks a ton for testing out my level and giving me feedback.

Here are the final changes.
1. Removed side waterfalls with no source (they were meant to be splashes affected by the main waterfall. I have just left the splash emitters)
2. Fixed floating Dock and added Blocking Volume (no more drowning bots)
3. WeaponBlock from Waterplane removed. Water is no longer bulletproof.
4. Removed Health Vials leading to Sniper Rifle.
5. Resized and Optimized terrain foliage to better fit the terrain as well as ground visibility.
6. Removed Collision from Tree Leaves.
7. Aligned Water Volume + Post Process Volume.
8. Trees should no longer grow out of rocks.
9. Minimized terrain stretching in noted area (thanks Odedge)
10. Assigned fitting material to lagoon rock formations.
11. Replaced Waterfall Sniper Rifle with Invisibility powerup.
12. Corrected Missing Temple Mesh - Set to Low. (Damnit this is it!!)
13. Enhanced the Cave to Connect the Players (Sorry Odedge, it aint goin' out!)
14. Worked on the center lagoon, adding more formations for vertical play, added bridge as suggested (sorry Odedge it has side railings. I did this to defy you!)
15. Removed Temple Well to prevent strafing grief.
16. There is now a reason to traverse behind the temple.
17. Added Armour in the Temple, obtainable by Double Jumping
18. Added collision to upper portion of temple face structures.
19. Enhanced Lighting.
20. Cleaned several clipping areas.

I tried merging my package into the UT3 file, with no avail. I was getting too many problems so decided to hold this as a slap in the wrist. I'll be sure to work out of no external packages next time. Please Excuse My Dear Aunt Sally.

The map is now available for Full Release. Thanks again guys, I really appreciate everyone here. Thanks again Odedge you were in particular of great help! I told my friends about you, phenomenal stuff man. Thanks again.

Hope you guys enjoy! Thanks and Happy Holidays!

Full Release!
http://forums.epicgames.com/showthread.php?t=646050