Dodge Jump?

[DeathKnightUT]

UT was UT long before dodge jump ever arrived.

Yes... but I know you know he needs THE explanation again...

Dodge is NOT Dodge-Jump

In dodge-jump, you make a dodge and, while still in the air, you jump.

[[SOTD]2-1b]

What is the best/cheapest video card to get for ut3??

[brdempsey69]

What is the best/cheapest video card to get for ut3??

That's quite off-topic, my friend, but no matter, I'll answer your question. It appears that the best bang for the buck for UT3 as far as price/performance ratio would be a GeForce 8800GTS 640MB. That would be my personal choice.

Back on topic, dodge-jump wasn't removed from UT3, because Epic never had plans to implement it into UT3 in the first place. Doesn't mean that the movement system in UT3 won't be good.

[Ultron]

I'm glad the dodge jump is gone. As I've stated before, the dodge jump brought about badly scaled maps. I have played a few user made maps and UT conversions that were actually scaled properly, and they felt claustrophobic when compared to UT2's wide open hallways and highly raised ft ceilings. I guess I could rephrase that and say that most of UT2's maps felt too vast and wide. Because of that vast feeling, you had to use moves like the dodge jump to get anywhere in a decent amount of time. UT3's maps look like they are scaled better for a faster paced and more grounded DM and CTF.

Better scaling=less airtime
Less airtime=more control

Exactly. I never want dodge-jump to screw with the scaling maps again.

[Lert]

Crotale speaks more truth than anyone else in this thread.

Amen.

[Ultron]

What is the best/cheapest video card to get for ut3??

Honestly, go to www.pricewatch.com and get an "X800" or "X900" series card for UT3. You might spend $200 or more, but it'll future proof your video card for the next year, essentially. GeForce 8000 or Radeon 2000HD series is the way to go. You can wait for the nextgen cards to come out in the next few months, though, but the downside is the UT3 demo and probably the game will be out by then.

[Xyx]

I wonder how long it'll take Epic to realize that "map size is not everything" also applies to vehicular gametypes. In any gametype, large map sizes place undue focus on the faster ways of transport at the expense of the other ways. This is probably the primary reason why you cannot walk around a power node without tripping over Mantas.

[Ultron]

That's a good point. I find super large maps to be frustrating, and are bound to make things like hoverboards and vehicles exceptionally-prominent on them. Hopefully there are some maps that aren't ginormous.

[Molgan]

The ONS-3on3 maps was the best, even with more then 3 players/team. WAR-3on3 anyone? :]

[Netic]

It's impossible to play without dodge man...

[Brutal]

But I'm sure some 1 will make a mutator for jump dodge or dodge jump

[[404]Cham3l3on]

*shrug*

The way I see it, it doesn't matter. This is a new iteration of the game, and as such I hope (and half expect) that Epic has taken past experiences to heart in terms of movement, i.e. what works doesn't work etc. They know the movement system well enough, and have the experience (something just shy of a decade?) to know how all the pieces-parts fit together.

The game will be what the game will be. That's the way I see it There is a good reason why they have removed it.

[Xyx]

I wish I had your irrational confidence. Epic messed up in UT2003 and only made slight adjustments for UT2004. Additionally, after a year of complaints about single primary node setups, they released the ECE with all four single primary node setups. To me, that indicates they are not infallible.

[Molgan]

It's impossible to play without dodge man...

OMG when will people learn the difference between a DODGE and a DODGE JUMP? This is freaking hilarious..

[theeDEATHMASTER]

not much but mostly used for traveling purposes, eliminated by hoverboard.

[[404]Cham3l3on]

I wish I had your irrational confidence. Epic messed up in UT2003 and only made slight adjustments for UT2004.

So I am an optimist, and I never said they were infallible, but that hopefully by this point (and many share in my optimism) they have nailed it. If they drop the ball on this release, what will most likely happen is it'll erase many of the prior hardcore players from the slate. *shrug* Either that or they'll kill the competetive scene (in the states anyways) by calling it a "dead game" weeks after the release.

[Demon Guardian]

Epic messed up in UT2003

Talk for yourself. UT2003-2004 >>> UT99 in my opinion.

[Xyx]

*sigh*

When was such a statement ever not subjective?

[SeLeX]

Greetz everyone - My first posting here :P

Dodge-jumps....hmmmm !!
I remember the run up to the release of UT2k *cough* 3, with features such as double-dodge, dodge-jump, and everyone was excited about it.
After playing the game however, I was left with the attitude ' the new dodge moves are ok, but could play almost as well without '
In UT2004, the pace of the game was almost that of UT99 so I found it a little more fun again.
Have to say, I found I naturally got into the rhythm of double-dodging when first playing UT2k* games. The dodge-jump was a move I rarely attempted for whatever reason. Could be I'm heavily entrenched to the UT99 play style of short distance dodging.
This way it forces players to keep ' acceptable ' distances from each other without travelling half the map and spamming.
For all those whose first UT experience is 2003/2004, get ready for the ol'skool close-quarter battling. That's part of what made UT great in the first place IMO !!
So I for one will not miss the dodge-jump too much !!

-Peace-

[Brutal]

*shrug*

The way I see it, it doesn't matter. This is a new iteration of the game, and as such I hope (and half expect) that Epic has taken past experiences to heart in terms of movement, i.e. what works doesn't work etc. They know the movement system well enough, and have the experience (something just shy of a decade?) to know how all the pieces-parts fit together.

The game will be what the game will be. That's the way I see it There is a good reason why they have removed it.

I think your right

[htm~crookward]

So, can anyone confirm that ut3 'will' have regular dodge? I know the 'dodge jump' isn't present. Anyone?

[Brutal]

Yes it will have regular dodge

[L'enculeur]

Gj at totally missing the point.

if your happy dodge jump is gone, then im sorry to say that you're on the level where my grandma can beat you. Ive never seen pro, or even good online players, "not" dodge jump. Great players dodge jump all the time, maybe not everytime, but alot. Its the fastest way to get around and frag.

ugh, and now they said its slower than ut2004, i hope its not like walking around in mud, cause thats what cs, halo, and other fps feels like. except quake. i want it mind numbingly fast where it feels like my character had a 12 pack of redbull with a hard-on while holding a gun awesome!!!

Umm you really don't know what you are talking about and I'm far from being a newbie at UT2004. First of all, if you've seen any video of UT3, you can see that the movement are much faster than UT2004, just like Epic said themselves. Two, no dodge-jump would feel weird in UT2004 with UT2004 gamepace, but UT3 is UT3... diffrent movement "faster" and so on so you won't miss it.

I'll even tell you why it's better that way. Without dodge-jumping, the fights will be more "close-combat" as else it's way too easy to run away and like Epic said, they don't want UT3 to be like people flying everywhere or more often in the air than on the ground.

[Green_Day_584]

dodge jump has no use. (except for being n00bish, and cause the fingers used for strafe dode jumping are the WEAK fingers, u end up bein headshoted anyway)

[Ultron]

Just to be clear here, the relative run speed of characters in UT and UT2k3/2k4 were _identical_. And from the looks of it, UT3 character run speed is the same. A brisk pace.

Dodge speed and distance were _identical_ in UT and UT2k3/2k4 as well. The arc was a little different, but in normal gravity you went the same distance. I've tested that extensively.

UT3 has _dodge_ but it will not have _dodge-jump_ but by what I've seen in the video, dodge is much like what we're used to in both previous iterations of UT. I couldn't tell you what's different about it if I tried, from what I've seen.

So let's not worry too much about Epic and movements - I think they got this.

[fuegerstef]

There are a lot who are better than you but still prefer a UT without dodge-jumping.

Wanna bet?

EDIT:
I was referring to a member whose posts are gone now.

[Ceil]

^ Indeed; I'll be laughing while the UT2 players are cryin' and moanin' that they don't have their precious dodge-jump while we old schoolers teach 'em how we kicked it back in the day ;)

For those sayin' that "it's not UT without dodge-jump!", remember that UT existed before UT2003 - and it was better. I have played UT2004, and I did use dodge-jumping because it was there; but I'm a UT old school fan, and I can definitely do without that move. You UT2 lot have a lot to learn if all your skills depend on dodge-jumping being in the game, and I can't wait to school yall ;)

[fuegerstef]

^ Indeed; I'll be laughing while the UT2 players are cryin' and moanin' that they don't have their precious dodge-jump while we old schoolers teach 'em how we kicked it back in the day

For those sayin' that "it's not UT without dodge-jump!", remember that UT existed before UT2003 - and it was better. I have played UT2004, and I did use dodge-jumping because it was there; but I'm a UT old school fan, and I can definitely do without that move. You UT2 lot have a lot to learn if all your skills depend on dodge-jumping being in the game, and I can't wait to school yall

I was talking about those who are really good at dodge-jumping.

[Boksha]

I still can't suppress a chuckle every time I hear someone say: "really good at dodgejumping".

[fuegerstef]

I still can't suppress a chuckle every time I hear someone say: "really good at dodgejumping".

Hey, rejoice. It really seems to be special for people like porn.exe* to tap the same key twice within a short amount of time.


*)The nickname alone is a hint that you cannot expect more from him.

[[404]Cham3l3on]

dodge jump has no use. (except for being n00bish, and cause the fingers used for strafe dode jumping are the WEAK fingers, u end up bein headshoted anyway)

Two things come to mind. The first is that simply because it was there, peeps used it. You can navigate a 2k* map much more quickly with it. Secondly you never use it in a fight against a skilled HS player.

This is kind of my point. 2k* maps were designed, and the gameplay in part was designed around the movement system (as should all good fps multiplayer games imo). You really cannot seperate the gameplay from the movement system.

That was one of my gripes (and still is) about the constant "oh hey n00b movement" etc. Everyone has an opinion and I see nothing wrong with that, but what I do find really annoying is the idea that a game 100% suXXorz because it aint '99. When UT3 is released, I am imagining it will still be different then '99. Is the '99 camp going to continue the saga this time around. Reminds me of Uncle Rico. It's a new game, let's move on and play the thing instead of constantly comparing everything.

/end rant

[Ceil]

Everyone has an opinion and I see nothing wrong with that, but what I do find really annoying is the idea that a game 100% suXXorz because it aint '99. When UT3 is released, I am imagining it will still be different then '99. Is the '99 camp going to continue the saga this time around. Reminds me of Uncle Rico. It's a new game, let's move on and play the thing instead of constantly comparing everything. :D

/end rant

We'll totally complain if it doesn't have that nice UT 'feel' to it (which 2004 was lacking; my PC at the time couldn't handle UT2k3 so I've never played it) :p

[danseko]

Where is the option "it is important for me to NOT have the dodge jump in the game"?

[Moloko]

It's a wait and see thing really, people can rightly say you're prejudging if you say it'll suck without before playing it on your own PC with your own key bindings.

The main problem could(only could) be the lack of fast direction change that dodge jump allows, leading to players who are half decent with the hitscan constantly cancelling each other out because the current two skills of movement prediction/accuracy could become just accuracy.

Another point is it could encourage spam fire by teams, esp with the flak cannon. Also the spider mines, if they're as fast and the splash damage from destroying them is anything like ut2k4 then removing dodge jump would be a stupid move.

[Brutal]

Where is the option "it is important for me to NOT have the dodge jump in the game"?

It isn't an option cus it isn't logical loL, cus dodge jump is something u do if u want lol, not like if its obligating you after you dodge press JUMP!

[1_8_7]

being a die hard UT99 player, i won't miss it at all.

[danseko]

Dodge jump in UT2 was a big part of what broke apart the genius rhythm from UT.
Secondly, the maps had to be built much bigger because of it.

Luckily, Epic seem to have decided a long time ago that this will be a dodge
only game, a very nice "less is more"-decision in my opinion, which brings
the focus back to the artform of basic dodging.

[DireWolf]

Well judging that i started playing UT with UT2k3, dodging is a must, without it, i think the game will just become like every other FPS and there is no reason not to just put the game down and pick up the next big FPS.
I believe without the dodging, Crysis would be better as the fast paced dodging is what makes UT so amazing...to me.

[Boksha]

The main problem could(only could) be the lack of fast direction change that dodge jump allows,

Wait, what?
The dodgejump only keeps you in air with the exact same speed in the exact same direction. How does that allow fast direction changes?

DireWolf: dodging is still in. Only the ability to jump in mid-air after a dodge (i.e. the dodgejump) is being removed.

[danseko]

I believe without the dodging, Crysis would be better as the fast paced dodging is what makes UT so amazing...to me.

Yep, well put, luckily everyone agrees on that, including Epic. ^^