You think it will be harder to dodge the Manta?

[Mardok]

With the increased gravity and the dodge jump taken away, do you think it will be harder to doge all the fast paced vehicles? Most of all, the Manta?

I really like the changes Epic is making to 2007, but the one worry I have is that experts with the Manta will go on Godlike killing sprees.

[FragMagnet]

I would guess that in all the playtesting that's happening something as obvious as 'vehicle == godlike' would be addressed.

[Mardok]

I would guess that in all the playtesting that's happening something as obvious as 'vehicle == godlike' would be addressed.

That was just a horrible exaggeration.

[The5thviruz]

but the one worry I have is that experts with the Manta will go on Godlike killing sprees.

How is this any different from UT2004?

[Jake-SF]

Yeah, unless your playing some uber competitive 1337 player (which I really dont care about because they are not the majority), the manta already kills wayy too easily. Dodge jumping don't work, the only things that work is fast reaction and use of the good weapons.

I dont know... they should find something against the mantas... getting killed by manta is not fun at all IMO. (instant killing stuff are bad things, unless they require really good skills or luck (headshot, direct hit with flak ball) or unless your playing something in which everything kills instantly (instagib))

[Hedge-o-Matic]

...the only things that work is fast reaction and use of the good weapons.

Well, as Han Solo once said, "That's the trick, isn't it?"

I think as long as the Manta's guns are reasonable, making it a "flying weapon with a seat" isn't so bad.

[Wail of Suicide]

I'm hoping that,

(1) Improved vehicle and physics means getting tapped by a vehicle moving at a speed your character can move on foot won't damage you (much less insta-kill you).
(2) The Manta either loses effectiveness in its guns, or loses effectiveness in the ease with which you can clip players, or both. The splash damage on the Manta plasma, in particular, is unnecessary. The guns are good enough without it at locking down nodes or hitting Goliaths/Paladins/Hellbenders/SPMAs.
(3) The speed of the Manta overall will be reduced. That it can effectively ignore most terrain and can 'dodge' up and down is a big enough advantage, it doesn't need to be significantly faster than other fast moving vehicles.

[ne_skaju]

I think this would balance reduced movement speed:

1)Instead of instakill huge damage (150-170hp) so, player with 199+150 may alive.
2)Manta get damaged and reduced in speed when hit player; get big damage when hit player with full charged impact hammer
3)increased momentum?


sorry for bad english, I hope you understand me.

[9ades]

In my opinion, the manta as it is currently, is often no match for a team of players working against it. A player running laps around Primeval won't get away with it for long. Even a single player who knows what he's doing can get the job done easily.

I quess in 2007, the manta agility will be nerfed along with the players speed. But I quess that's what most of us was assuming...

[ShredPrince]

I make mantas my B*** on foot.Don't know about that in UT07 though.....

I see the point of the thread: I guess we'll see.

[fuegerstef]

On most maps there is this nice Weapon some refer to as ASMD.

You'd be surprised how effective that weapon can be against Mantas. In close quarters and in long range.

[Nietzsche]

Mmmh, this topics brings a different thing on my mind: I'd really love to have different damage values for damage inflicted to ppl and damage inflicted to vehicles/nodes etc. a 2-shots-kill-a-manta shock rifle would be nice :> Plus one could nerf the manta-shots to be less effective against ppl ... or make the tank less effective against ppl and more effective against vehicles ... could do some sweet stuff

[Apathy]

Shock primary, or secondary almost completely stops it. No need to dodge.
Most of the time I've been killed by a Manta, it isn't cause I couldn't get out of the way, it was because it came by surprise (in back of me, or while fighting someone else)

[fuegerstef]

Shock primary, or secondary almost completely stops it. No need to dodge.
Most of the time I've been killed by a Manta, it isn't cause I couldn't get out of the way, it was because it came by surprise (in back of me, or while fighting someone else)

Yep, true for me too.

[Nietzsche]

though more difficult, flak can do the same thing

[Concept]

I'm hoping all vechs speed will be changed to fit new player speeds.

I haven't played for a while so not 100% sure but as long as the powerful weapons cause it to change direction/speed its fine.

That said the whole "speed effects damage" would be great.

[Jrubzjeknf]

A single AR nade stops them in their tracks.

[blackout]

just get an ASMD and shoot the manta up in the sky

[Draco]

i too think it will be more dificult for the foot solder to fight mantas, but everyone seems to assume the manta will be "nerfed" i doubt that, u have to remeber that the necris vehicles are going to have vehicles just like the manta that are quick moving, the "viper" comes to mind of the one that they have released pics of.

not to mention the manta is perfectly balanced with all the other vehicles in the game and can be killed by other vehicles rather easily, with the right players in it of course...

so the only possible way to "nerf" the manta is if they just nerfed all of the vehicles across the board, and that would just be terrible imo. so im sure you will most likely see the manta close to what it is in 2k4 with just a few sutle changes.

[{SM}LeadSniper]

all i care about is being able to duck under the manta like i normally do, its surprising how many players for get to use the crouch command on the mantas. i abuse that by ducking then nailing it with a rail gun (BW mod RS you are my gods lol) when they pass over. i take them out in 1 hit.

[Hedge-o-Matic]

I hope they work on the sound positioning, frankly. This is what makes the manta such a danger from behind; a lot of players don't hear it at all until it clips their heads off, and then suddenly we hear it at full volume.

Similarly, when I first started playing 2k4, I would always think someone was just behind me because the sounds of pickups and footsteps is "centered" on the spot where they <i>were</i>, and so they always lag just a bit behind you if you're running.

[SleightOfHand]

With dodge-jump removed I think it will make evading Mantas more difficult, if vehicles' movements keeps close to UT2K4. In open field the hoverboards may help with that, but if you're in the middle of a fight, you'll have to whip out the shock or AVRiL. I'm sure it's a problem Epic is already looking at, if it isn't already solved.

[»madMar†y»]

all i care about is being able to duck under the manta like i normally do, its surprising how many players for get to use the crouch command on the mantas. i abuse that by ducking then nailing it with a rail gun (BW mod RS you are my gods lol) when they pass over. i take them out in 1 hit.

Try jumping over a manta, that's usually the more safe way and this reduses the chance of getting killed by a manta. Many good players DO use the crouch feature on the manta and then you're pancaked.

[Scylla]

Don't worry, there will be plenty of hoverboard monkeys who will avoid the manta with their hoverboard.

[{SM}LeadSniper]

Try jumping over a manta, that's usually the more safe way and this reduses the chance of getting killed by a manta. Many good players DO use the crouch feature on the manta and then you're pancaked.

true, buts its more gratifying if kill them from right under them. literally lol.

[JaFO]

For people that are deaf, dumb and blind the Manta will always be difficult to evade.
To anyone else it will be a piece of cake, unless the manta-pilot/driver has godmode active.

Remember this comment on (British) fighter-tactics from World War Two :
two pairs of eyes are an asset
one pair of eyes is a liability ...

And if that fails to trigger anything then I'd suggest you study the behaviour of animals like cows and rabbits. There's at least one of them watching for predators regardless of what the others in the team are doing.

[da ghost]

I think this would balance reduced movement speed:

1)Instead of instakill huge damage (150-170hp) so, player with 199+150 may alive.
2)Manta get damaged and reduced in speed when hit player; get big damage when hit player with full charged impact hammer
3)increased momentum?


sorry for bad english, I hope you understand me.

that's already the case for #1. the vehicles were never insta-kill, it just seems that way because they hit so many times/econd of contact.

#2 is half true already.

3) You can't have #2 and #3 at the same time.