Thought Experiment

[Icker]

All 3 rifles removed. Both shotguns removed. All Grenades removed except Smoke. No weapon pickups. Everybody can only play as Marcus. The only level is Gridlock. All servers are dedicated (no host advantage possible). Your only weapon loadout options are 1 of the three pistols (counting Gorgon as pistol rather than smg) and 1 smoke grenade.


Tell me: How long before the discussion of which pistol is breaking the game parallels exactly the discussion we have over the current weapon loadout and how only veterans use the snub because it's the most versatile and has the most "interesting gameplay."?




That's ridiculous, you say? Yeah, it is... isn't it

[All My Rage]

Thinly veiled SO support thread much?

[BlueTowel]

All servers are dedicated? I'm sorry, but my suspension of disbelief will only stretch so far.

[AwfulCreature]

I would of say.. "boltok pistol" is OVERPOWERED becouse i can blow your head with one single shot.

[Icker]

No, I actually abhor the sawed off beyond the casual game mode. I just think people should realize how the arguments look from a different standpoint. Compartively it seems arbitrary. I'm not a supporter of any weapon by itself, per se, I just really love this game and hate to see it fall so far because of its community losing appreciation for the game. Thus I tried provide a way for some (most likely not all) to see what I see when I read threads on here.

[VegetAryan]

How long before all of the sawed off fans quit because they now have to aim for their enemies?

[Smokey Amp]

People were making Boltok montages in Gears 1/2. It's been accepted as a good addition to the game, but it is a pick-up; it's obviously more powerful than a snub. Not really a decent comparison to the sawn-off/gnasher debate.

Gorgon is wank.

[Icker]

All servers are dedicated? I'm sorry, but my suspension of disbelief will only stretch so far.

Hahah, I agree. I'm just saying this hypothetically, but I know...some things are even too bold for that.

[AwfulCreature]

How long before all of the sawed off fans quit because they now have to aim for their enemies?

DUDE, this thread is not about SO... GTFO!!! :) plz? "PISTOLS"? what is the matter? your penetrated brain can not think further from your ass being pawned by a SO?... ur sad..

[TenTonDog]

When the Hardcore playlist was in effect there were people complaining about the pistol.

I nearly cried, I really did.

[Icker]

People were making Boltok montages in Gears 1/2. It's been accepted as a good addition to the game, but it is a pick-up; it's obviously more powerful than a snub. Not really a decent comparison to the sawn-off/gnasher debate.

Gorgon is wank.


I'll entertain you by arguing int he fashion I made this post, which was...rhetorical.... but I'd posit that any good Gorgon user could take a Boltok user 1v1 at least 7/10 times. With no hosting, the amount of cheap headshots you got in 1/2 goes down by about 40%.



These are all facts of course... O_o

[Icker]

When the Hardcore playlist was in effect there were people complaining about the pistol.

I nearly cried, I really did.



This is what I'm getting at here.

[BlueTowel]

People were making Boltok montages in Gears 1/2. It's been accepted as a good addition to the game, but it is a pick-up; it's obviously more powerful than a snub. Not really a decent comparison to the sawn-off/gnasher debate.

Gorgon is wank.

Gorgon is good for close-range shooting, so it would fill that gap.

[TenTonDog]

This is what I'm getting at here.

I seem to remember starting a thread at the time stating despite my hatred of the SOS, it should remain in the game, because if EPIC take it out, the community will whinge about the next weapon on the list (probably the Retro) until there's nothing left. It's a slippery slope.

[Smokey Amp]

I'll entertain you by arguing int he fashion I made this post, which was...rhetorical.... but I'd posit that any good Gorgon user could take a Boltok user 1v1 at least 7/10 times. With no hosting, the amount of cheap headshots you got in 1/2 goes down by about 40%.



These are all facts of course... O_o

Two active Boltoks are enough to down someone. How can the Gorgon compete with that? Plus it has much more precision than a Gorgon.

[eth-meth]

Thinly veiled SO support thread much?

How can people be so dense? This is not a Sawed Off support thread. This is a thread to see how much of any single aspect will people complain about.

[VegetAryan]

Two active Boltoks are enough to down someone. How can the Gorgon compete with that? Plus it has much more precision than a Gorgon.Active reloading the boltok doesn't increase its damage.

[Snowblind]

I seem to remember starting a thread at the time stating despite my hatred of the SOS, it should remain in the game, because if EPIC take it out, the community will whinge about the next weapon on the list (probably the Retro) until there's nothing left. It's a slippery slope.

Well it would only be a slippery slope, at most, until the retro is also removed. So there's not much a snowball effect really because everyone is familiar with the gnasher/lancer/hammerburst.

Honestly, though, I would rejoice to see the SOS removal. I had the worst games yesterday against an entire team of wallbouncing SOS folk. It was the most frustrating experience I've ever had on gears 3.

On the other hand, I don't really mind the retro. So I wouldn't petition its removal.

[Smokey Amp]

Active reloading the boltok doesn't increase its damage.

You sure? I've been hit by Boltoks recently that have put me full red in one shot.

[Icker]

You sure? I've been hit by Boltoks recently that have put me full red in one shot.

I'm not sure about the AR benefit on the Boltok but I know two things about it. It has a nasty habit of sometimes not registering two shots when you get hit if someone quickly fires two rounds and that, alone, one shot is enough to put you beyond half red (as it should given it's a pick-up and demands accuracy.)

I'm not saying you're wrong about the Boltok being the most powerful, that's actually what I'm getting at (it would become the so/retro when compared) but if I want to keep going with this... the gorgon with an AR can down somebody in 2 bursts. It has a larger clip, reloads quicker and is a lot more deadly in mid to close quarters combat. The boltok can be used greatly at mid to long range, but as far as a dueling weapon I'd put my money on the gorgon simply because it's the only automatic in the group yet still has substantial power.

[Smokey Amp]

I'm not sure about the AR benefit on the Boltok but I know two things about it. It has a nasty habit of sometimes not registering two shots when you get hit if someone quickly fires two rounds and that, alone, one shot is enough to put you beyond half red (as it should given it's a pick-up and demands accuracy.)

I'm not saying you're wrong about the Boltok being the most powerful, that's actually what I'm getting at (it would become the so/retro when compared) but if I want to keep going with this... the gorgon with an AR can down somebody in 2 bursts. It has a larger clip, reloads quicker and is a lot more deadly in mid to close quarters combat. The boltok can be used greatly at mid to long range, but as far as a dueling weapon I'd put my money on the gorgon simply because it's the only automatic in the group yet still has substantial power.

You're probably right. However, the Gorgon and Boltok were both designed as map-spawn pick-up weapons. The entire idea behind their design was to be a better alternative to the snub.

It wouldn't be the same case as with the retro or DBS, as they've always been at the same tier as the other load-out weapons.

[BlueTowel]

I'm not sure about the AR benefit on the Boltok but I know two things about it. It has a nasty habit of sometimes not registering two shots when you get hit if someone quickly fires two rounds and that, alone, one shot is enough to put you beyond half red (as it should given it's a pick-up and demands accuracy.)

I'm not saying you're wrong about the Boltok being the most powerful, that's actually what I'm getting at (it would become the so/retro when compared) but if I want to keep going with this... the gorgon with an AR can down somebody in 2 bursts. It has a larger clip, reloads quicker and is a lot more deadly in mid to close quarters combat. The boltok can be used greatly at mid to long range, but as far as a dueling weapon I'd put my money on the gorgon simply because it's the only automatic in the group yet still has substantial power.

The Gorgon is fully automatic now. Just sayin'.

[ahgha]

You forgot to mention the addition of a NEW pistol. One that, if you fire it, it kills the entirety of the enemy team in one shot. But don't worry, it only kills if you shoot the ground and it has a really long reload so that makes it fair.

[BlueTowel]

You forgot to mention the addition of a NEW pistol. One that, if you fire it, it kills the entirety of the enemy team in one shot. But don't worry, it only kills if you shoot the ground and it has a really long reload so that makes it fair.

You kinda ruined the fairly nice discussion we had going here. :(

[DungeonMaster27]

boltok=hammerburst
snub=lancer
gorgon=retro
nuff said

[ahgha]

You kinda ruined the fairly nice discussion we had going here. :(

Not really. I am just adjusting what the OP said for accuracy. He suggested that there was a parallel between the pistols and the shotguns, and I couldn't help but feel that there wasn't really a pistol that paralleled the Sawed off in its-

A. Lack of necessity for aim.
B. Killing power.
C. First appearance in a franchise.

If anything, I opened a new door for discussion on this topic. Enjoy.

[yeche]

All 3 rifles removed. Both shotguns removed. All Grenades removed except Smoke. No weapon pickups. Everybody can only play as Marcus. The only level is Gridlock. All servers are dedicated (no host advantage possible). Your only weapon loadout options are 1 of the three pistols (counting Gorgon as pistol rather than smg) and 1 smoke grenade.


Tell me: How long before the discussion of which pistol is breaking the game parallels exactly the discussion we have over the current weapon loadout and how only veterans use the snub because it's the most versatile and has the most "interesting gameplay."?


That's ridiculous, you say? Yeah, it is... isn't it

Believe it or not this is a great post guys. Perfect point. Snub pistol would be the lancer, Boltok would be the retro, and gorgon would be the HB ( Because of its weakness. )

or Boltok would be the equivalent to the DBS ( sort of ) and Snub would be the Gnasher.

[michibee]

there is no way you can compare a power pistol with the snub. how about only the snub ?
pick up pistols are great and totally different . they are all fine . not like the SOS a piece of sh@#$. gun for noobs

[Xephyria]

How is everyone that posts here so dense?

The first post is nothing more than a hypothetical situation - saying that if you stripped Gears 3 down to (arguably) its weakest weapons, with no other factors, people would still have something to complain about. This is not a thread to argue the merits of the various pistols.

It also pisses me off to no end to see every thread - especially interesting and unique ones like this - get tarnished with the LOL SAWED OFF SUX brush. At the risk of repeating what has been said already ad infinitum, it's not hard to avoid when you see it coming, and if you didn't see it coming then just about anything would have killed you anyway.

[Mord]

Well it would only be a slippery slope, at most, until the retro is also removed. So there's not much a snowball effect really because everyone is familiar with the gnasher/lancer/hammerburst.

You haven't seen the countless "nerf _____ rifle" threads lately? Notice even though the Gnasher is (still) the most used and most successful gun in the game that nobody ever calls for a nerf on it?

OP is correct. People WILL agree over anything, even if we were fighting with sticks.

[DoctorG27]

The gorgan would be the first to get called out. It is the easiest to use. Then it'd be everyone spawning with the boltok, because it has the biggest risk/reward system.
Btw, in this scenario,
snub=lancer
boltok=hammyb
gorgan=retro

Almost no debating that.