Nali cows

[Bitter-Pill]

Last time around Flak asked me to make some nali cows for UT2004. I made a few, and got a mixed response. Some don't like the idea, others just didn't like my version. So, this time around is there anyone wanting more cows? If I do make them for UT3 they'll be fully rebuilt with a much better shape and textures. They would look more like the originals but with much more detail. Anyways, let me know if you want them, what you'd like to see, what you liked or hated about the original models or mine.

[ScottUT]

I liked the ut2k4 versions...But there were multiple versions. When I could see other peoples skins, and i slapped mine on, no one could see it.

Id like to see ones that look mor elike UT99 included with the skins this time around, but feel free to be creative.

[ne_skaju]

With all new reinforced graphics, nali cows should participate in tournament.

[BigJim]

I still use the Atomic cow as my model to this day BP, I say go for it. :D

[Madmanxan]

yeah itll be interesting to see the cows go in UT3 :)

[Shadow Dancer]

I just want their sleek, cute looking strafing animation back.

[Mort_Q]

The problem, irrc, with the nali cow, was that you still had to hit where the head would have been on a different model to get a headshot... and that seems to me, to be as fairminded as playing as Matrix in UT2.

Not sure it'd be any more fair to have the hitbox moved to the cow's head either.

YMMV.

[Bitter-Pill]

I've never had a problem getting headshots on any of my models. Often they feel too easy to me. The thing to know about the cow, is that the model's head is a large spherical camera that the gun arm hangs from. Shoot the camera and you get a headshot. My guess as to why so many people have trouble with this is that the model's silhouette is different from humanoids, people aim for the cow's biological head, and/or the model wobbles as it runs, possibly throwing off a person's aim. This video shows that when you aim at the camera, you do get headshots. Sorry for the crappy video quality.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ToAVycizJ5Q

[hawkwind]

yeah , definitely make them for ut3.
except for the flame staying around, there were no issues
. bring it on, i will support it


The thing to know about the cow,

hehe

[Bitter-Pill]

except for the flame staying around, there were no issues

I fixed that, or at least I haven't had it occur since I released a second version. To get the fixed version follow the link in my signature. If you have the old version you need to remove its upl file found in your ut2004/system folder so that they will no longer show up in game. If you're saying that you've seen the problem persist using only the newer version then let me know. Thanks for the support. :)

[Xero]

Yes Bitter-Pill. I always loved the Nali Cows from the first UT and I think that your Nali Cow models will be very welcome.

[Kariedar]

Go for it! Loved the ut2004 cows u made! :D

[Snowcat]

Absolutly, the Nali Warcow is awesome, I'd love to see it return proper!

[Caravaggio]

I always regretted not finishing my version. I was thinking about it again the other day and thought of another idea I had at the time - that they'd make great vehicles. I don't know how it'd work now that the only sitting animation is for the hellbender with players, where they don't turn their heads, but I think it's still feasible. If you do this maybe I'll just take that route instead.

Either way. Cows MUST find their way into the next gen!

[Ar0nnax]

I think its a great idea. Not just to have a classic model rebuilt for UT3 but to show modders that any model can work properly if done right. As for the head shot area, a member(Innociv) on the forums suggested sticking a pole with a mask or a sphere to indicate the head shot area. Might stand out a little too much, but then again thats what the Nali WarCow (Its gotta be the Warcow man!) does best.

[PricklyPoo]

I think its a great idea. Not just to have a classic model rebuilt for UT3 but to show modders that any model can work properly if done right. As for the head shot area, a member(Innociv) on the forums suggested sticking a pole with a mask or a sphere to indicate the head shot area. Might stand out a little too much, but then again thats what the Nali WarCow (Its gotta be the Warcow man!) does best.

Ya the head shot box shouldn't be a problem, people that are using the warcow want attention, so they will have to sacrifice for more head shots on them. :D

[Bitter-Pill]

Thanks for all the new comments.

OK, here's just a thought to bounce around. What if I impaled a human head onto a tall spike on the cow's back at regular head level with a stupid expression on his face? Too gruesome or too funny? Post any thoughts you have.

[Caravaggio]

I don't see how it could be too gruesome, it's just not as logical since it's already dead. I kind of liked the camera idea.

[Ar0nnax]

I'm thinking too gruesome man, it'll make me focus on the head and not the Warcow. It really depends on how much of a contrast it gives. I think any sort of indicator works fine as long as it has the proportions of a head. Heres an idea, you can place its heart or a brain (As if its controlled by an intelligent being.) in a container above the pole. This way it'll explain the cow getting hit by a "headshot" and going down.

[Snowcat]

I'm no modeller so I don't know how this all works, but now days, can't a head box be placed anywhere? Surely nowdays it doesn't still need to conform to the varied other models around it does it?

Figuring since it hasn't already been done or stated I guess its not an option available. So Heres another idea to add to the pot.

Suppose the cows aren't actually trained for combat etc, but are guided by clever nanotechnology, nueral circuitry, advanced machinery and programs. The bulk of which is located in their backpacks, and in order for them to function in battle a transmitter atop the backpack is required. This transmitter could (i dunno like a radar dish in appearance or something) be our headbox. So why wouldn't the cow just go back to being docile after the transmitter is destroyed via 'headshot'? Because the feedback from damaged would rip through the nueral circuitry and fry it's brain, thus killing it of course :)

You could also use this as basis to explain why the cow could use vehicles... The various programs and such withint the backpack could pilot the vehicles vie remote, but it's range is so limited that the cow needs to be in the vehicle (thus dispelling arguments the cows could just use vehicles from afar to wage war without having to be near them).

Or at least, thats the idea for the Nali Team bonus pack idea I had in mind for UT04

Thoughts?

[Caravaggio]

The problem is that the cow's guns are traditionally up high. If the headshot zone were moved then it would be unbalanced when compared to the other models since he'd be able to hide it better in some instances, causing a much larger furor than that seen over in the camera view problem thread.

I kind of like the alien controller idea, with a brain in a jar (maybe he's being ridden by a dwarf or one of those squid things from Metal Slug), but that's really just a modification of the camera.

[NakhtiUT3]

Whatever you have to do ... just get these cows into UT3 please.

[Allcars]

Cows please That would make Ut3 the best ever!

The problem is that the cow's guns are traditionally up high. If the headshot zone were moved then it would be unbalanced when compared to the other models since he'd be able to hide it better in some instances, causing a much larger furor than that seen over in the camera view problem thread.

I kind of like the alien controller idea, with a brain in a jar (maybe he's being ridden by a dwarf or one of those squid things from Metal Slug), but that's really just a modification of the camera.

True but really when you think about it if the tournaments where real then what would stop a cow from being able to join aliens can so why not. Maybe cows are just better warriors.

[Snowcat]

well this new model wouldn't have to be 100% true to the original, time has past, upgraded design n so forth.

also, i guess by the last response you can't now days put the head box anywhere?

[Bitter-Pill]

Here are my current thoughts. I'll build them as two separate models this time; each with its own style. The AtomicCow will appear more like an armored soldier while the WarCow will be more like a mounted beast.

AtomicCow:

1. goes back to having 4 jet rockets (same as UT)
2. cow armor more detailed with a style similar to GoW and UT3 models
3. the robot camera returns and is much more detailed


WarCow:

1. has 2 jet rockets (same as UT2004)
2. cow skin more detailed with a style similar to the aliens in GoW and UT3
3. the robot is replaced with a small alien rider (sort of like a gremlin)

[Ar0nnax]

WarCow:

1. has 2 jet rockets (same as UT2004)
2. cow skin more detailed with a style similar to the aliens in GoW and UT3
3. the robot is replaced with a small alien rider (sort of like a gremlin)

I like where you're going with the 2 separate models, but wouldn't it be easier to just reskin the Warcow like the original UT had it?

Under the new engine it's going to make it look pretty awesome. I just hope you can pull it off.

A little creature (Just depends on whether or not the creature would fit in with the character, you'd also need the whole saddle and mounted look.) like that on top of it would be cool. I can already picture myself sniping it off. :D

[Bitter-Pill]

Here's something I need feedback on. I took my UT2004 version and altered the legs. Should the cows' bone structure remain 100% true to the original or is some change in order? Give me those opinions.

Original Style
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v518/thebitterpill/nalicowoldlegs.jpg

Something Different
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v518/thebitterpill/nalicownewlegs.jpg

[Snowcat]

I think the second on there is the winner. Its more feasible and realistic really. If they were exist in real life it is more likly their legs would be in this manner.

as for two different models, no need for that really is there? can items like armor padding and extra jets not be made to be null/invisible at choice through the course of skinning the model anyway?

also, i really like the way the camera and weapon mount is shaped and set out, kudos, i think that is well and fine enough to use :)

[Ar0nnax]

http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/9880/177042copysi3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
The original UT model although outdated, looks like it fits in more. Its the style thats presented. Large weaponry instead of sleek pretty ones. By looking at the textures you can tell that its knees were visualized to bend forward (Though I like where you're taking it, it makes his hooves seem MUCH smaller). The Thighs were very large as well, as expected of a creature that relies on 2 feet for mobility. Id suggest having the mechanism on his back cover more of its body. Id say just drastically work up from the original design.

Its got a face not even a mother could love huh?

[Caravaggio]

I like the original look of the legs. The second may seem more real to some but that's a case where I just prefer the original look. Either way one problem I have with bot models is that the legs seem to be eminating from the stomach, when they should be connected to the spine in some way. The original ut model kind of does the same thing, but the legs still start higher than what you have there.

[stephen_wq]

They would look more like the originals but with much more detail. Anyways, let me know if you want them, what you'd like to see, what you liked or hated about the original models or mine.

Original Models. Make as close replica of the model as possible, then skin it. If you can make Atomiccow and Warcow.

[[s§s]Bison_Boy]

How about a Nali Bison?

[Caravaggio]

Nali Manatee was second in line. One thing at a time!

[superspak]

i support this, i really want the warcow as it is the only character i use in ut99 and i still do

[Phoenix86]

id say keep it to UT model, and make the machinery less futuristic and more industrial/primitive, like the original...it makes it feel like a crazy animal with machines just stuck to its back hehe

and the feet/hooves need to be larger imo, more like original

the gremlin is a good idea, but how about a nali child?! it is a nali cow afterall :)


great job on the work though, its superb. i wish i could do what you do

[Cuddles]

I would really like to see Nali Cows in UT3 and even some Nalis, but plz no cartoonish skins, KTHX.:p

[SLGDon]

naliwarcow with a premiscous lauren or ariel as a rider=)

[Caravaggio]

I'm afraid if I point out the misspelling of promiscuous I'd have to ask why you'd want her to be that way around the cow... ...it's not really a visual description.

[Bitter-Pill]

So, I merged the Epic Ironguard model and NaliCow files, in order to scale the cows to fit the new game.
I went to get a sandwich and came back to this. I hope Epic doesn't want their guy back, because there's not much left of him. :(

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v518/thebitterpill/donteatthat.jpg

[Caravaggio]

Iron is good for a growing cow!

Also: Are you going to split the hooves or is that a more final model? How many polys are you up to?
edt: or that's just the temp model from they last page...

[Lakie]

I quite liked the Nali Cow for UT2004, and when I played UT99, that is the only character I played as.
I believe most of the UT3 characters get more detail through bump mapping (or displacement) or something but I'm sure you know more than us about that. ;)

One minor issue with the UT2004 one though, why was its robotic arm considered its head, surely the hit box should have been around the true head? :confused:

Otherwise good luck,
~ Lakie

[JohnnySix]

Hehe, you wait ages for a cow, then three come along at once! :D

I've not got UT3 yet, until I can get a machine , there's not much point, but was inspired to dig out the old model I'd been working on, and in the end decided to make it again from scratch.

I originally ran out of enthusiasm after I couldn't find someone to collaborate with on the rigging/animation. :p

Are you going to be making both Atomic / War cow?

I was going to try make both this time, and with the atomic-cow having fully-armour plated chunks.

The cow with the backpack was the 2k4 cow , the one without is the new starting base-mesh for the new cow. (with a lot more detail to be added in yet for normals etc.)

http://fc01.deviantart.com/fs24/f/2007/341/f/5/nalicow_ut3_wip_by_JohnnySix.jpg

[iron12]

I thought your UT2004 cows where cool. Yeah I want to see the cows come back.

[Bitter-Pill]

Are you going to be making both Atomic / War cow?

Yes both. I mentioned that in post #25.

[JohnnySix]

Ah, I skipped pages 2-4. :-/

So we gonna prefix the names? :D?

[Bitter-Pill]

So we gonna prefix the names?

You can name your's whatever you like. It won't make any difference to me. I use unique names.

[headfog]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TMMwzNnktmU

[LameMule]

Sooo unrealistic movie.... cow would have won anyday :)

Ever since I bought UT3 I have been looking everywhere for the caws. If you bring em back your defenetly my hero 8)

I do think you should split the hoof though 8)

[Gareee]

http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb2/Gareee_photos/Misc/Nali-warcow.jpgAfter seeing another thread, i decided to try my hand at a war cow.. I went with a version with a "butt", and also a more fun face.

This is a lightwave subcaged version, and once devided would come out to about 5000 polys, without his back armament. I've got no clue on how poly heavy UT3 model can be,. and he could be enhanced with a normal map as well.

If someone could get him working in UT3, I'd be happy to donate him to the project.

[Gareee]

I kinda liked Johnny six's leg approach, even though it isn't "canon", so I modded mine some, and did a quickie weapons platform.http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb2/Gareee_photos/Misc/Nali-warcow2.jpg

[Caravaggio]

Aw screw it, I might as well do another cow so we can get the total cow army up to a good dozen before the end of the week. :p

[Sharpshotoo7]

Here are my current thoughts. I'll build them as two separate models this time; each with its own style. The AtomicCow will appear more like an armored soldier while the WarCow will be more like a mounted beast.

AtomicCow:

1. goes back to having 4 jet rockets (same as UT)
2. cow armor more detailed with a style similar to GoW and UT3 models
3. the robot camera returns and is much more detailed


WarCow:

1. has 2 jet rockets (same as UT2004)
2. cow skin more detailed with a style similar to the aliens in GoW and UT3
3. the robot is replaced with a small alien rider (sort of like a gremlin)

How about plasma cow

1. has 3 jet rockets
2. has awesome fur
3. and awesome taunts like super moooooo

[4TX4]

I kinda liked Johnny six's leg approach, even though it isn't "canon", so I modded mine some, and did a quickie weapons platform.http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb2/Gareee_photos/Misc/Nali-warcow2.jpg[/img]

Man, this cow looks absolutely AWESOME!! I especially like the tongue / silly expression. :D I really hope someone can put this fine creature ingame...

[QUOTE=Caravaggio;25181738]Aw screw it, I might as well do another cow so we can get the total cow army up to a good dozen before the end of the week. :p

Yes plz, the more the merrier! Your cow is one of my favorite 2K4 models, its (unintentional?) death animations (the eyes & mouth) made me lol hard the first time I saw them, and in fact still make me :). It's these little details that make a good model great, even if it's just a beta. So yeah, if it's at all possible, by all means port your wonderful cow...

[Bitter-Pill]

Hehe, you wait ages for a cow, then three come along at once! :D


Aw screw it, I might as well do another cow so we can get the total cow army up to a good dozen before the end of the week. :p

You two have fun. I no longer make nalicows. I'm going to take my UT2004 nalicow model and evolve it into a new creature with a new name. It will be something fresh and unique. UT had its cow, and by request I made one for UT2004, but I think UT3 needs something all its own. I believe that anyone who liked my cow will also like this new thing too, maybe even prefer it to nalicows; but we'll see. :)

[Gareee]

Bitter pill, everyone wants the same thing.. new better cool models for UT3. Doesn't matter who makes them, so long as there are more then the junk bots we only can choose from now.

The biggest thing we need to do is stick together, and help each other out.

[Phoenix86]

heres a link to some cool ideas in the form of concept art for "animals"

ConceptArt.org Forums: Creature of the Week (http://www.conceptart.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=81)

[Caravaggio]

You two have fun. I no longer make nalicows....
Well I was kind of joking so unless those two guys actually animate theirs then we might, once again, be cowless?


Yes plz, the more the merrier! Your cow is one of my favorite 2K4 models, its (unintentional?) death animations (the eyes & mouth) made me lol hard the first time I saw them, and in fact still make me :). It's these little details that make a good model great, even if it's just a beta. So yeah, if it's at all possible, by all means port your wonderful cow...
Yeah I was never figured out the kismet thing for deaths. But there were bigger problems then that, he didn't crash your game with link deaths?
Nice that someone actually remembers though. :p

[Maximum_Jason]

OK if someone does make a classic Warcow like the UT99 one, it has to walk funny like the old one too :D those things were so hilarious to fight against. love the voicepack to :)

Moo!

[Gareee]

That was kinda what I had in mind when I modeled mine.. ;)

[rek]

i for one vote pro cow!

[Gareee]

I changed plans, and decided to make mine a commercial poser figure.

Here's a few wip images....

http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb2/Gareee_photos/FlyingRender.jpg


http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb2/Gareee_photos/balancingact.jpg

http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb2/Gareee_photos/backview.jpg

[HideInLight]

That thing has "shoot me" written all over it...

[Gareee]

Heheee....

[Henrik]

That is... disturbing