EPIC: Stronger Lancer Poll ( & PRO mode )

[hoOk]

ok, i know theres a thread already on this, but we need numbers here.

im all for this.

To say this game is a stop and pop game on-line, you are COMPLETLY WRONG, PERIOD.

This is my second favorite shooter of all time, compared to Counter-Strike: SOURCE. Now that is a STOP AND POP GAME, if u arent behind something, you are dead after a split second, it makes you realize how valuable life really is.

now to my point with COUNTER-STRIKE, in that game, rifles and sub-machine guns have GREAT STOPPING POWER, something the lancer doesnt even come close to having, WE'VE all seen it:

"when your getting shot at with the lancer, have no fear, do a barrel roll and blast em in the face with the shotty!"


to me, thats ridicoules, i want a game, were it takes skill to pull off a shot, thats why it feels so damn good to get a kill with the TORQUE BOW! because it takes SKILL!

there really isnt a lot of concequence if someones firing a lancer at you, u dont get the feeling that its a real weapon is being fired, its just, a loud noise....

and since it is a stock weapon on start up, some say "it cant be raised in fire power because of the hammerburst out powering it", well, simple solution: RAISE THE HAMMER BURST's POWER TOO!


PLEASE READ THIS SECTION FOR ALL OPPOSERS:

and for the Folks who DO NOT want the lancer UPPED IN POWER, ive found a solution to MAKE EVERYONE HAPPY!:


EPIC, how bout this, a new game mode called "PRO" and having 2 game types for online multiplayer. one called "CASUAL", one called "PRO"

where as in the game type PRO; RIFLES, PISTOLS, LONGSHOT upped in power, to give the option for more skilled players to go at it, to keep it real, as in where u need skill to get a kill. and theres no rushing, and u actually use the stop and pop technique....
--
And now "CASUAL" is the mode we already have to play now, this gives us more game choice and style in this game.
---
im not for the two mode game type, but it would be better than nothing, it would keep the tactical fans around.

[ClientSideHitDetec]

I shal vote YES

[madmax]

wtf is that pro mode crap, why the hell would increasing all weapon damage make it "Pro."

[hoOk]

it is an idea if the majority of people want stronger weapons, but in two diferent game types, as where PRO mode offers stronger weapons for more advanced players, or players who hate the lancer and other guns suckiness in their power, and want a real mans game.

[Anirak]

Look, the damage doesn't need to be upped, the lag just needs to be removed. Client side hit detection, end of story. Check out my video (episode 2) in my sig for more information on the whole situation. The lancer has some serious stopping power when no lag is involved.

[hoOk]

hey buddy, i just watched those videos, its amazing, i did not even realize lag caused the game to bog that much... thats truly amazing,

but i still do agree it needs to be upped, at least twice the ammount of power it is already at, to counter the shot guns power. even without the lag its still a wimpy ass gun. period.

[Anirak]

hey buddy, i just watched those videos, its amazing, i did not even realize lag caused the game to bog that much... thats truly amazing,

but i still do agree it needs to be upped, at least twice the ammount of power it is already at, to counter the shot guns power. even without the lag its still a wimpy ass gun. period.

Thanks for watching, I agree it could be upped some and make the game better. This game needs to be more stop and pop like it was supposed to, right now people can get away with charging across the level.

[m Brooksay]

I like the idea of a stronger Lancer, but you're carrying this a little too far. Epic isn't even going to consider a pro-mode, I can tell you that with confidence.

If anything (and it's the simplest) just make the shotgun weaker.

[Anirak]

I like the idea of a stronger Lancer, but you're carrying this a little too far. Epic isn't even going to consider a pro-mode, I can tell you that with confidence.

If anything (and it's the simplest) just make the shotgun weaker.

Eh, I think the shotgun's distance is a little insane, but the power is fine. To be honest, I really believe if the lag issues were resolved, this game would be fixed 95% (including the problem the OP brings up in this thread).

Also I agree, there is no chance in hell any "pro" mode will be added, whether it's a good idea or not.

[hoOk]

yes believe me, i know there will never ever ever ever be a pro mode, but i was throwing that out there just to show that the game could have more strategy and the game could do better from having a stronger lancer/hammerburst.

[m Brooksay]

Eh, I think the shotgun's distance is a little insane, but the power is fine. To be honest, I really believe if the lag issues were resolved, this game would be fixed 95% (including the problem the OP brings up in this thread).

Also I agree, there is no chance in hell any "pro" mode will be added, whether it's a good idea or not.
After watching your video (which I PMed you about) I agree with your statement by saying just adding client-side hit detection, all of our "weak gun problems" will be gone.

Imagine how much less 'random' we'll have if we had client-side hit detection.

[V1c10us]

PLEASE READ THIS SECTION FOR ALL OPPOSERS:

and for the Folks who DO NOT want the lancer UPPED IN POWER, ive found a solution to MAKE EVERYONE HAPPY!:


EPIC, how bout this, a new game mode called "PRO" and having 2 game types for online multiplayer. one called "CASUAL", one called "PRO"

where as in the game type PRO; RIFLES, PISTOLS, LONGSHOT upped in power, to give the option for more skilled players to go at it, to keep it real, as in where u need skill to get a kill. and theres no rushing, and u actually use the stop and pop technique....
--
And now "CASUAL" is the mode we already have to play now, this gives us more game choice and style in this game.
---
im not for the two mode game type, but it would be better than nothing, it would keep the tactical fans around.



If you want games with this level of competition online, just play a PC game, what you're proposing is something that many game makers would leave in the hands of mod makers, but since the 360 is such a closed platform, it's impossible for any third party modifications to a game. Console games will never be as competitive as you're proposing online.

Don't waste your time begging Epic for things they almost certainly will never do with their games

[KayBeL]

The lancer's damage does not need to be upgraded. I've already posted in another thread why it doesn't need it, so I won't bother explaining again. Also, I see in your signature that you think the pistol should also receive a power upgrade. I can understand slightly why you'd think the lancer is too weak, but the pistol? It takes three shots and one melee to do down someone with the pistol, and you can whip their head right off with it like a sniper (not even taking into account power shots). If anythings it's too powerful already.

[hoOk]

this is certainly not a waste of time, there is no doubt that there is lag causing these weak weapons to suck even more so. If they want to keep a comunity happy and want people to buy the next game, they will listen to US, just like Mark Rein always says ( sarcastic lol )

i DO play PC games, i LOVE them, unfortunaly my PC was destroyed by UPS, so i bought a 360 for in the mean time until its fixed, but jesus, there is a problem here.....

[hoOk]

The lancer's damage does not need to be upgraded. I've already posted in another thread why it doesn't need it, so I won't bother explaining again. Also, I see in your signature that you think the pistol should also receive a power upgrade. I can understand slightly why you'd think the lancer is too weak, but the pistol? It takes three shots and one melee to do down someone with the pistol, and you can whip their head right off with it like a sniper (not even taking into account power shots). If anythings it's too powerful already.

not really, in every other game, the pistol is a powerful weapon, it might as well not be their in gears of war. its completly useless. its only cool to use it to "pwn" someone with a weak gun, its like killing someone with a smoke nade.....

[KayBeL]

this is certainly not a waste of time, there is no doubt that there is lag causing these weak weapons to suck even more so. If they want to keep a comunity happy and want people to buy the next game, they will listen to US, just like Mark Rein always says ( sarcastic lol )

i DO play PC games, i LOVE them, unfortunaly my PC was destroyed by UPS, so i bought a 360 for in the mean time until its fixed, but jesus, there is a problem here.....
Okay, I guess I want the hammer of dawn to instantly kill anyone I point at. I'm going to get 1,000 signatures because Epic has to listen to their community, that way it'll definately make it in the next patch

EDIT: Are you kidding me? Seriously I don't know whether or not to take your last post as a joke. The pistol easily counters the lancer if your close enough, and the shotgun if you just dodge their one shot (that's all the chance they get to stop someone with a pistol) and melee them and give'em another three shots or another melee. If you have two people using it together on one person, his head will blow off in three shots each. With the speed you can shoot it that's only a second, not even giving him enough time to react. The pistol is an amazing weapon, and like I said before, if anything it's over powered. If you think the pistol is like a smoke grenade, you obviously don't know what you're talking about.

[ZertosS]

Lancer is plenty strong, you just need to be able to hit your target when you pull the trigger, no bullet lag would instantly make the lancer better.

[m Brooksay]

The pistol thing is pushing it. You can rip someone's head off without even downing them with it, and you want it to do more damage? Lol @ that.

[m Brooksay]

Lancer is plenty strong, you just need to be able to hit your target when you pull the trigger, no bullet lag would instantly make the lancer better.

That's all we need. No bullet lag. God dammit. All these other mediocre games for the 360 have client-side hit detection, and then the most amazing console game in history comes out and we gotta deal with bullet lag online? Dammit all.

[Makaan599]

Look, the damage doesn't need to be upped, the lag just needs to be removed. Client side hit detection, end of story. Check out my video (episode 2) in my sig for more information on the whole situation. The lancer has some serious stopping power when no lag is involved.

Those videos of yours are pretty nice. Feel free to add me if you want another tool fanatic in your list.
gamertag is makaan599

[DiscombobulatedThi]

Lancer is very good as it is. Brings enemies down if you know how to use it properly. The key is 1) positioning so you can spray without them being able to take cover, 2)little care about your ammo so you can spray it all, active reload, spray some more, and 3) teamwork, as in either mass lancer them so they can't move up easily, or have a shotty or 2 take point and a lancer backing em up. Very powerful.

Here is a vid of a GOOD lancer user (I'm about on par, and I NEVER host):
linky (http://useruploads.mythica.org/view/Denovos_Raven_Down_GP2_Jan_10th.wmv)

P.S. Not me or my vid

[Black RL]

I vote for NO.

The lancer is a mid/long range well balanced weapon.

Last night I killed 2 guys at the same time just with the lancer, and, if you combine 2 or more lancers the firepower is awesome.

The most difficult team I ever played against they only used practically the lancer and they were deadly.

If the lancer was much stronger, combat would never end, people would stay in cover the all game not doing nothing.

The game is alright now.

Just my opinion.

[Squiddy]

yes believe me, i know there will never ever ever ever be a pro mode, but i was throwing that out there just to show that the game could have more strategy and the game could do better from having a stronger lancer/hammerburst.

WTF?! 'Stronger' hammer bursts are you insane?! It is already the gayest weapon of GoW much like the sword in halo 2. lol 'PRO' mode. Surely if you were making things easier for everyone it would a 'NOOB' mode?

The lancer is fine, if your lagging then find some regular people to play with that don't lag or start looking at the latency counter by the host name in ranked.

When you're not lagging at all and you cannot kill someone charging at you, who has no cover then that is just down to your poor abilities with the weapon.

It sure as hell serves more purpose than 'just a loud noise', IF you know how to use it properly that is.

Oh and to the person who said the majority of people would want it stronger, funny how the poll says the complete opposite eh?

[Mein Kampf]

If they leave the Lancer as it is, the Pistol is more powerful. I really don't care, because medium range weapons aren't very useful in this game, but it's a matter of realism here - Can a small sidearm have a higher damage output than a bulky assault rifle?

As mean as the Lancer looks it barks a lot more than it bites.

But then again, the reason medium range weapons are worthless is because of bullet lag. The game would be almost perfected with no bullet lag, and the Lancer wouldn't need a power boost because you wouldn't have to lob bullets. We'll leave that one up to you guys, Epic.

[m Brooksay]

If they leave the Lancer as it is, the Pistol is more powerful. I really don't care, because medium range weapons aren't very useful in this game, but it's a matter of realism here - Can a small sidearm have a higher damage output than a bulky assault rifle?

As mean as the Lancer looks it barks a lot more than it bites.

But then again, the reason medium range weapons are worthless is because of bullet lag. The game would be almost perfected with no bullet lag, and the Lancer wouldn't need a power boost because you wouldn't have to lob bullets. We'll leave that one up to you guys, Epic.

that comment saddens me, because I don't think Epic thinks bullet lag is that big of a problem.

I mean, do the guys that made this game even play it online? Don't they see the bullet lag as a major issue?

[ShikamaruIRL]

I find the thread's premise humorous, because I always felt the lancer was overpowered. Honestly, you can shoot at someone and down them in 2 seconds with that gun. Especially for a default weapon with a secondary-auto-kill, it should have been toned down a bit. It makes the hammerburst, in most situations, obsolete, which is a true shame.

I will not vote, since I dont think the game is fine the way it is, nor do I want it to be more powerful.

[Mein Kampf]

I find the thread's premise humorous, because I always felt the lancer was overpowered. Honestly, you can shoot at someone and down them in 2 seconds with that gun. Especially for a default weapon with a secondary-auto-kill, it should have been toned down a bit. It makes the hammerburst, in most situations, obsolete, which is a true shame.

I will not vote, since I dont think the game is fine the way it is, nor do I want it to be more powerful.

The Hammerburst will beat the Lancer every time unless you're standing within lumberjack range.

[snl25]

As stated before, the Lancer does not need to upgraded. Just the addition of Client-Side Hit Detection. I too do not understand why it was not included, my only conclusion could be because Microsoft was rushing Epic to get the game out by the end of '06. If that was included with a good Lobby system, and party system this game could be flawless and in my opinion better then Halo 3.

[snl25]

Lancer is very good as it is. Brings enemies down if you know how to use it properly. The key is 1) positioning so you can spray without them being able to take cover, 2)little care about your ammo so you can spray it all, active reload, spray some more, and 3) teamwork, as in either mass lancer them so they can't move up easily, or have a shotty or 2 take point and a lancer backing em up. Very powerful.

Here is a vid of a GOOD lancer user (I'm about on par, and I NEVER host):
linky (http://useruploads.mythica.org/view/Denovos_Raven_Down_GP2_Jan_10th.wmv)

P.S. Not me or my vid

That is a perfect example of Host Advantage along with the other posters signature videos "The Gift," and "The Gift: Parable of Lag." That video (from the quote) shows the host (you can tell from the blood that splatters on his screen) hitting people dead on without any bullet lag. That is why I don't use the Lancer much online when I join matches (which is 99% of the time).

[Kilo]

Make it stronger.

[darkkshadow449]

If it was any stronger host lancer would be tear people new assholes left and right.

Leave it how it is.

[Kilo]

At least let us change starting weapons.....if yall dont want lancer to be stronger at least make us have a hammerburst as our starting weapon.

[ThePigster]

I don't like the idea of increasing the lancer power, but I like the idea for a "Pro" game mode. Something where you have to rely on cover and team strategies more. And headshots would count for alot.

[Dethecus]

The lancer is fine, if your skilled with the lancer you can be very deadly.

[C3RV3ZA vBi]

I only read a few lines of the first post.

You must be joking?!? Every weapon in this game, if anything, is over-powered. You simply need to remember what was said in all those gameplay videos we watched before gears was released.

"gamers will need to learn to stand still when they're shooting. Moving makes the weapons incredibly innacurate."

You should try standing still/ keeping your weapons accurate. It only takes a quarter clip, non active, to down people. The pistol is perfect the way it is.

[hoOk]

dude, ive been playing shooters for years, and dont give me any crap about gun sway and standing still.... try taking a shot in day of defeat with a sniper rifle, u have to wait for that thing to level out.

the lancer is a weak gun, plus the fricken bullet lag, seriously, the gun is weak, it takes over 10 shots to DOWN someone, that bs, should be minimum of 3 to kill them, jesus, the shot gun only takes 1, if u aim right.... duhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh hhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[Teufelhunden75]

I will not claim to be a god on Gears of War because I am not, I have plenty to work on in terms of the game. But what I have discovered is an easy ability to take people out at medium range with the lance, or generally, with smart positioning and movement someone trying to use the shotgun while I have the lance equipped. Most people aim for the head or body with the lance, body is a good choice for landing shots, but inaccuracy of the gun makes aiming for the head a bad choice. Call me crazy, but I noticed when one aims for the legs specifically the knees it is quite effective even when they dodge and roll, because they continue to take damage as you are aiming low. I can't begin to count how many times I started hitting someone at the knees and when they rolled toward me to try and get that shotgun they were downed in the middle of the roll or near the end because I was still landing bullets into them as they rolled. Just a little piece of advice for those who can utilize it. Of course most people I tell that too prefer a different approach but hey that works for me, so i would say to keep it the way it is and let us as gamers find a way around it, after all, if the gun is as bad as everyone claims it to be, then you need to find a way around it and show your resiliency and thinking abilities as a veteran of shooters.

[Stinky Pete]

Weapons are fine as they are.

You would only need better weapons if you were really crap.

IMO weaker weapons would make a better player.

More powerful = easier kills. how would that be pro:confused:

The game is fine as it is, maybe its your connection speed or just the lag you are experiencing.

If you cant have fun the way the game is go and play something else.

[Hazed and Abused]

Pro mode? LAFFO.

[Sundull]

VOTE: Yes

I just got done helping someone out beating the campaign on hardcore and actually kept the lancer for the majority of it. While playing with it, I realized that the lancer's damage was perfect; it was not too powerful but was more of a threat and suppressed more than it does now in multiplayer. I believe the lancer's damage should be increased to the damage it does in hardcore. For those who oppose this, try playing the campaign on hardcore one more time...

[apocalypse 3da]

leave the lancer alone, it's just fine, aim for the head and you'll see your opponents drop asap!

I do think the blastoff from the boomshot is too weak, shot needs to be spot on to kill instantly

[wonkers]

ok, i know theres a thread already on this, but we need numbers here.

im all for this.

To say this game is a stop and pop game on-line, you are COMPLETLY WRONG, PERIOD.

This is my second favorite shooter of all time, compared to Counter-Strike: SOURCE. Now that is a STOP AND POP GAME, if u arent behind something, you are dead after a split second, it makes you realize how valuable life really is.

now to my point with COUNTER-STRIKE, in that game, rifles and sub-machine guns have GREAT STOPPING POWER, something the lancer doesnt even come close to having, WE'VE all seen it:

"when your getting shot at with the lancer, have no fear, do a barrel roll and blast em in the face with the shotty!"


to me, thats ridicoules, i want a game, were it takes skill to pull off a shot, thats why it feels so damn good to get a kill with the TORQUE BOW! because it takes SKILL!

there really isnt a lot of concequence if someones firing a lancer at you, u dont get the feeling that its a real weapon is being fired, its just, a loud noise....

and since it is a stock weapon on start up, some say "it cant be raised in fire power because of the hammerburst out powering it", well, simple solution: RAISE THE HAMMER BURST's POWER TOO!


PLEASE READ THIS SECTION FOR ALL OPPOSERS:

and for the Folks who DO NOT want the lancer UPPED IN POWER, ive found a solution to MAKE EVERYONE HAPPY!:


EPIC, how bout this, a new game mode called "PRO" and having 2 game types for online multiplayer. one called "CASUAL", one called "PRO"

where as in the game type PRO; RIFLES, PISTOLS, LONGSHOT upped in power, to give the option for more skilled players to go at it, to keep it real, as in where u need skill to get a kill. and theres no rushing, and u actually use the stop and pop technique....
--
And now "CASUAL" is the mode we already have to play now, this gives us more game choice and style in this game.
---
im not for the two mode game type, but it would be better than nothing, it would keep the tactical fans around.

I think you don't understand. Increasing the Lancer's damage will destroy critical game balence. Also, this isn't CSS. No one wants to wait in a lobby for 10 minutes, get in the game and be taken out in the first 20 seconds. Then be taken out again and again by a team who's only using the lancer. Now I will make this very very clear.

YOU CAN NOT MAKE THE LANCER KILL PEOPLE FASTER THAN THE TIME IT TAKES TO REVIVE YOUR TEAM MATE!

You havn't played the game long enough to be an authority on game play mechanics. I don't want a thousand Halo or Counterstrike players spamming the forums and crying to devs to change a game to their liking.

YOUR $60 CONTRIBUTION TO EPIC AND MICROSOFT DOES NOT MEAN YOU ARE ENTITLED TO HISSY FIT "UBER SHOOTER" IDEAS INTO PATCHES!

Pack up your insane self-centered ideas and just enjoy the game as it was meant to be. The artistic vision of the developers and only them.

Becuase I sure as hell don't trust you people on these forums to make the right decisions. Suck it up.

[pho20]

for players that want the lancer more powerfull.....

learn to think past your nose.

if the lancer is made more powerfull, how the hell will you kill the host?
the host will be godlike with this weapon.

think about this before you come up with crazy ideas.
its not the lancer, its lag.
the lancer is perfect when playing SP or playing as Host.
making the Lancer more powerfull is not the answer.
fixing/minimizing the lag is.

[JAG30504]

leave the lancer alone, it's just fine, aim for the head and you'll see your opponents drop asap!

I do think the blastoff from the boomshot is too weak, shot needs to be spot on to kill instantly

Not against a good opponent, not enough of the shots land when aiming at the head and people who are skilled at the game make that shot even harder. May work against some opponents but not many who have been playing the game for a while. But hey, to each their own, if you get it to work more power to you.

[Beagles]

YES! Im sick and tired of the Lancer being the gun everyone drops to switch weapons. Everytime I play this game online, I always wish the game was like the Insane difficulty in single player. If you stick your head out too long, youre dead. As of right now this game is run and gun, and until these guns get an increase in power, I might as well go play RB6 since it doesnt have the bullet lag GoW does.

And it would be PRO mode. You would have to be extremely careful everytime you move. Casual mode would let you run around like dummies (like you can now) without worrying about getting killed by the pea shooter (Lancer).

Its sad too. I remember the first day when it was "stop and pop" before everyone realized rushing with a shotgun is a much better solution.

Im disappointed in this game. This game is fun due to the incredible graphics and increased gore, but the gameplay is lacking online.


Make it like SINGLE PLAYER INSANE!

[Hornet]

All we need is to have CSHD or NewNet as the system instead of Standard Server.
I've had enough. I'll play a little more now that grenade tagging has been nerfed some and there are two more maps, but until CSHD or NewNet is the system I won't play it a lot. Because every time I go back to the Shadowrun Beta, it's like playing a game from 2006 and then going back to play a game made in 1994.
Comparison:
Leading your targets: Only in GoW, and you have to have a LOT of lead.
Total Bulls##@ moments: Happens quite a lot in GoW, but the only time it happens in Shadowrun is when you're outplayed--not because of lag.
Host advantage: None in SR, but a huge one in GoW.

So you see why going back to play GoW online is kind of a letdown.

[hoOk]

I think you don't understand. Increasing the Lancer's damage will destroy critical game balence. Also, this isn't CSS. No one wants to wait in a lobby for 10 minutes, get in the game and be taken out in the first 20 seconds. Then be taken out again and again by a team who's only using the lancer. Now I will make this very very clear.

YOU CAN NOT MAKE THE LANCER KILL PEOPLE FASTER THAN THE TIME IT TAKES TO REVIVE YOUR TEAM MATE!

You havn't played the game long enough to be an authority on game play mechanics. I don't want a thousand Halo or Counterstrike players spamming the forums and crying to devs to change a game to their liking.

YOUR $60 CONTRIBUTION TO EPIC AND MICROSOFT DOES NOT MEAN YOU ARE ENTITLED TO HISSY FIT "UBER SHOOTER" IDEAS INTO PATCHES!

Pack up your insane self-centered ideas and just enjoy the game as it was meant to be. The artistic vision of the developers and only them.

Becuase I sure as hell don't trust you people on these forums to make the right decisions. Suck it up.

this is suppose to be a gun, not a nerf gun, jesus christ, it has virtually no stopping power... and it is true, everyone drops the lancer for nething else, get with the picture, fix the lag and up the gun

[Mike072490]

uh the pistol already counters the shotty...just pump a few shots into them and melee them...an instant down...stop complaining because i suspect you constantly can't think of using any other weapon than the lancer you start with...

[BigTru]

Pistols counter the shotty if the shotgun user doesn't know how to use the left analog stick or the roll/roadie run button.

[armagon917]

I believe the lancer should not be more powerful mainly because imagine what active reload would be like. If wielded by an experienced player the lancer is already very deadly.

[hoOk]

thats the point, the gun should be more powerful... and its not very deadly, so, if we had a poll what everyones fav start-up weapon is, i can garuntee it would be the shotty....

[SPBTooL]

Look, the damage doesn't need to be upped, the lag just needs to be removed. Client side hit detection, end of story. Check out my video (episode 2) in my sig for more information on the whole situation. The lancer has some serious stopping power when no lag is involved.That is a great video for showing off the bullet lag and I love the Tool references.

CSHD would go a long way towards making the lancer/hamerburst feel as they should. But even with CSHD there is one thing I would like to see changed on the machine guns:

Remove or greatly decrease the damage drop off at range. You want the stop and pop, move from cover to cover game play back? This is what will do it. It would in no way change the close to medium game play for the shoty/melee love.

I also think it would be cool if the machine guns could pop heads the way the pistol can. Although this may be too powerful for execution games.

[hoOk]

lancer/hammerburst should POP heads, and for an execution game, why not, u get the bonus of a kill for a skilled head shot with the gun.... in REAL LIFE if u get a machine gun to ur head, that **** is ripped completly apart.....

[Jedison]

I voted no, the thing is Gears Of War is a game where realism isn't top notch. The pop and stop mechanic works good. I think the real problem is people being to lazy to adapt to the Gears Of War Lancer. It's how it is and it's what makes the gameplay actiony and frantic. I only use the lancer even up close and I would consider myself probably one of the better players in GoW. Just learn how to use it. The Lancer is PERFECT as is. It makes suppression fire with it excellent. It also makes flanking more essential. I think you have to realize this is GoW no CS Source, and if you want a different game you should probably start looking rather than wanting this one to change. I love GoW and I think it's perfect. The patch made it even sweeter.

-Xbox Live tag - KidQuamen

[Jedison]

Plus I enjoy using the Lancer against those too lazy to figure it out.

[ur huklbry]

The Lancer is fine ... team up with a teammate and concentrate your fire on one guy. He'll be dead in half a second. You shouldn't be going all Rambo and running around with that thing.

[Omega360x]

I'm gonna have to disagree on this. You know how the saying goes,

"Don't try an fix what isn't broken."

[Lol Cheese]

Its fine the way it is... A great starting out weapon and with steady aim it rewards with a quick take down.

[Black RL]

Its sad too. I remember the first day when it was "stop and pop" before everyone realized rushing with a shotgun is a much better solution.

I voted for NO but I must agree with this quote.

The game is "stop and pop", but with random teams, in wich everyone goes for their life like a bunch of idiots, the obvious solution it's the shotgun because you can roll to an alone oponnent and try out your luck, maybe it's your time to "splash" the dude out, maybe not, but you will still try, then you will do the same exact thing again, or just grab a pair of grenades and do the same procedure.

Like I said before, if you face an organized team, things are more different, when you try the close range aproach, you end up down and DEAD very quickly, and shoot by what? the lancer.... that's right....

Maybe the all problem with online is the party system, or maybe the shotgun is too much strong, not the lancer too weak, I believe the lancer was imagined to be used in "pairs", I think they didn't conceived the lancer to be strong when used alone, so the problem occurs, as most people play alone, they change to the shotgun, and grenades, and easy close combat kills.

I think the game right now isn't "pop and go" or "run and gun", it's more "each one for itself", or "I hope my shotgun blows I'm up first".

The solution?

The "famous" party system that is to come, let's all wait.

The only thing I found annoing about the lancer, it's the incapacity to down a folk that is in front of you and then rolls, and you know..... blows you up with the shotgun, but I think the problem isn't power, the problem is accuracy I think.

Just another opinion to help us all think.

[Jedison]

No no, leave all the party system non-sense out of this thread. You can play a player match too with friends, the Lancer isn't stronger in a ranked match it's the same. You don't need to be playing with friends for a Lancer to be good either. Know when to shoot, when to rush, when they're weak, and they're reloading and you'll be fine.

Plus my only rant about ranked matches is that people are speaking pure bull****, when I go into a ranked room with randoms we always end up working out a strategy or at least 2 of the other 3 teammates end up working together. So I really think people need to get over it and spend more time practicing.

[Black RL]

Don't "stress", it's just an opinion ;)

Anyway, I think the major problem with the lancer is accuracy.

You must agree that everyone is using shotgun in this days.... you can't deny that....

[ZionEntity]

Man, the Lancer is more powerful since the patch. I down guys with just the Lancer as they run up on me to tag me. Ive been even downing them as they roll at me thinking they evade the shots. just aim at knee level and all shots are on target. :)

[Black RL]

I will try that, your not the first one to talk about "knees" :)

[5noopy]

the lancer is def weak, most games just turn into a shotty fest, i dont think that it iss waayyyyyyyyyyyy to weak, just needs to be a little stronger

[Black RL]

most games just turn into a shotty fest

True.........

[hoOk]

True.........


exactly my point, no tactics, all rush and shoot

[Jedison]

Then learn how to counter the shotty Rush. It's very easy. Even if your teammates aren't on your friendlist you can always stick with them for a little back up.

[JAG30504]

Man, the Lancer is more powerful since the patch. I down guys with just the Lancer as they run up on me to tag me. Ive been even downing them as they roll at me thinking they evade the shots. just aim at knee level and all shots are on target. :)

Funny I have been talking about that a lot on here, glad to see it works for someone else.

[hoOk]

Then learn how to counter the shotty Rush. It's very easy. Even if your teammates aren't on your friendlist you can always stick with them for a little back up.

i figured out how to counter it, another shotty! [/end sarcasm]

[Jedison]

Then why don't you just use the Shotty if it suits you? (/end imperviousness to sarcasm)

[War of Gears]

Isn't the Lancer a head shot, and downing weapon? That what I thought it was. I think the Lance is fine just the way it is... Plus, it doesn't shake that much when you fire it ether. So, instead of making the Lancer stronger, they should just add an Assalt Rifle minus the chainsaw, and add more shake to it.

[snl25]

Isn't the Lancer a head shot, and downing weapon? That what I thought it was. I think the Lance is fine just the way it is... Plus, it doesn't shake that much when you fire it ether. So, instead of making the Lancer stronger, they should just add an Assalt Rifle minus the chainsaw, and add more shake to it.

They already have one in the game. The one you start with in the Prison Blocks has no chainsaw and is just a regular assault rifle. They could simply include that in the list of weapons.

[JAG30504]

Either way just look at the poll, twice as many people like it the way it is.

[War of Gears]

But that weapon sucks though. They need a better... more revamped, assault rifle..

[goyanks135]

the lancer doesnt need to be stronger. just needs bullet lag to be removed.

[Nemisis680]

I voted no not just because it's fine but i diden't want it yes for wayyyyy to weak


it is good but a little bit stonger is ok

[Jedison]

If they made the Lancer stronger people would be complaining that it's too hard to get up close to use the Chainsaw or Shotgun and that everytime you go out in the open you die instantly. Remember people this is Gears Of War, not Counterstrike or Ghost Recon.

[SluGSlinGa]

hey buddy, i just watched those videos, its amazing, i did not even realize lag caused the game to bog that much... thats truly amazing,

but i still do agree it needs to be upped, at least twice the ammount of power it is already at, to counter the shot guns power. even without the lag its still a wimpy ass gun. period.


the shotgun is always supposed to be more powerful than the lancer shot for shot. but its all about the range, at close range shotgun is gonna win, upping the damage of the lancer so that it can compete with the shotgun at close range is stupid and takes away from the purpose of the shotgun.

[hoOk]

shot gun should be a side arm, a tool for up close combat, face to face, but there is nothing to counter it correctly, so the shot gun becomes the main weapon, seriously, u cant even argue this, just play 5 games online and see how bogus this is

[JAG30504]

shot gun should be a side arm, a tool for up close combat, face to face, but there is nothing to counter it correctly, so the shot gun becomes the main weapon, seriously, u cant even argue this, just play 5 games online and see how bogus this is

Then why is it I can handle people fine with my lance by aiming for the knees at people using the shotgun? God forbid you try to find a way around the damage difference and be creative, lets just make the developers work harder instead.

[hoOk]

ok buddy, at least i dont live in denial, and for about half of the poll voters to think the gun sucks, is pretty fricken big, epic should take note to that.... u wouldnt get those numbers in any other game...

[JAG30504]

WTF?! 'Stronger' hammer bursts are you insane?! It is already the gayest weapon of GoW much like the sword in halo 2. lol 'PRO' mode. Surely if you were making things easier for everyone it would a 'NOOB' mode?

The lancer is fine, if your lagging then find some regular people to play with that don't lag or start looking at the latency counter by the host name in ranked.

When you're not lagging at all and you cannot kill someone charging at you, who has no cover then that is just down to your poor abilities with the weapon.

It sure as hell serves more purpose than 'just a loud noise', IF you know how to use it properly that is.

Oh and to the person who said the majority of people would want it stronger, funny how the poll says the complete opposite eh?

If you were referencing me, I meant how the poll says that more people prefer the Lance stay the same . . . which it still does, by quite a majority I might add.

[JAG30504]

ok buddy, at least i dont live in denial, and for about half of the poll voters to think the gun sucks, is pretty fricken big, epic should take note to that.... u wouldnt get those numbers in any other game...

Living in denial? 38 to 65 and you are saying WE are living in denial? Yeah, pretty sure the guy who says this is a big problem and the poll he created is against him yet says I, who the poll agrees with, is living in denial, pretty sure you are the one in denial there. And most games you do get complaints like that about certain guns and the such, but what the hell does that have to do with the fact you are being outvoted here, you are just trying to take the issue away from that fact.

[EagleEyes]

at the topic, i think the pro mode is an excellent idea, although its not really "pro" mode, its more of a "real" mode, where u get downed in 2-3 bullets of any normal weapon and 1 of the high pwoered weapons

o and "Before you complain about the Lance's stopping power try aiming for the knees when shooting someone trying to charge you with the shotgun. " the knees arent the weak point in MP, they are in SP, yes, but the ehad is the spot in MP

[hoOk]

more than half hate the gun, thats really bad numbers if i were a developer, seriously....

[Omega360x]

60% against 30%, looks like theres nothing wrong with the Lancer. Just people complaining cause they're getting owned.


EDIT: just wanted to add that the Lancer is a great noob starter weapon. Easy to use.

[Jedison]

Actually 31%, don't like the Lancer. So why would Epic change something the majority like to please the minority of players who don't even know how to play the game in the first place? Please tell me you were born with some form of logical reasoning. Actually...forget it.

[JAG30504]

more than half hate the gun, thats really bad numbers if i were a developer, seriously....

Stop changing the subject or avoiding what I said, you accused me of living in denial, yet you are the one ignoring what the poll clearly states.

70 - 47 at the time I am editing this.

[JAG30504]

at the topic, i think the pro mode is an excellent idea, although its not really "pro" mode, its more of a "real" mode, where u get downed in 2-3 bullets of any normal weapon and 1 of the high pwoered weapons

o and "Before you complain about the Lance's stopping power try aiming for the knees when shooting someone trying to charge you with the shotgun. " the knees arent the weak point in MP, they are in SP, yes, but the ehad is the spot in MP

Not with the lance unfortunately. I agree with any other gun it is the head, like say the Hammerburst even, (obviously Boomshot is the exception considering you need a dead on hit normally). But the spread of the Lance's shots means that anything past a really small burst you wind up missing the head with a good portion. Also when people start out aiming for the chest or head and the person they are firing at roadie runs at them or dodges, the bullets fly over or the adjustment is hard to make. When aiming at the knees, the adjustment to continue hitting them as they run is easier and you land more bullets as they run or dodge as well, even when they dodge you land bullets at the legs or feet as the body dodges, not always but I have seen it happen for me quite often. I know, no one believes it, but try it out someday.

[tiskoe]

I didn't read the whole thread, but the Lancer should be able to pop peoples heads off much the same as the pistol, rewarding the more skilled users (people that can actually aim at the head and not just the body which is really noob in my book) with an instant kill.

[JAG30504]

ok buddy, at least i dont live in denial, and for about half of the poll voters to think the gun sucks, is pretty fricken big, epic should take note to that.... u wouldnt get those numbers in any other game...

You still haven't replied to the fact that the poll sits at 58% liking the Lancer the way it is.

[Omega360x]

ok buddy, at least i dont live in denial, and for about half of the poll voters to think the gun sucks, is pretty fricken big, epic should take note to that.... u wouldnt get those numbers in any other game...


LOL HAHAHAH!!

120 voters out of 2million. 120 voters out of 215,000+ players online.

and the majority of the voters voted the lancer is fine...

[Jedison]

LOL HAHAHAH!!

120 voters out of 2million. 120 voters out of 215,000+ players online.

and the majority of the voters voted the lancer is fine...

^^^^^^^^^^^^^

[hoOk]

did u ever learn any math? the ratio is still the same no matter how you scale it, and seriously, those numbers SUCK BALLS. period. almost half hate the damn thing, at least a third, the multiplayer is very basic and does not have a lot of depth, and if u argue that, take a look at any other shooter. you cant even chose your start up weapon, ppffft.

[Jedison]

I've learned math, logic, statistics, and grammar. All of which you lack.

[hoOk]

umm..... have you read my post? you are probably learning disabled. in ratio, the numbers are still the same, and about 40% want the gun changed, and that is a HUGE number of people...... ive never heard of a gun in any game that gets as much sh1t as the lancer..... if i were a developer, id meet the needs of both halves and make diferent weapons, allow the host to have restrictions and make the host allow difernt start up weapons... the gameplay as described by the developers is totally misleading.

[Omega360x]

did u ever learn any math? the ratio is still the same no matter how you scale it, and seriously, those numbers SUCK BALLS. period. almost half hate the damn thing, at least a third, the multiplayer is very basic and does not have a lot of depth, and if u argue that, take a look at any other shooter. you cant even chose your start up weapon, ppffft.

My numbers come from Microsoft and GoW online. Just to add to those numbers, hasn't GoW sold 3million copies now? Last time I looked online there were 253,000+ players online and still you only have 127 votes. I think people know where to complain if they don't like something. :rolleyes:

[Omega360x]

umm..... have you read my post? you are probably learning disabled. in ratio, the numbers are still the same, and about 40% want the gun changed, and that is a HUGE number of people...... ive never heard of a gun in any game that gets as much sh1t as the lancer..... if i were a developer, id meet the needs of both halves and make diferent weapons, allow the host to have restrictions and make the host allow difernt start up weapons... the gameplay as described by the developers is totally misleading.

So 40% out of the 127 people who voted don't like the Lancer. What about the other 2,999,873 GoW owners that think its fine? What about the 200k+ online who think its fine?

[ajay]

40% may be a lot, but it certainly isn't a mandate from which Epic would decide to make such a change - especially as not all purchasers of the game, or even those who play online, have voted. Even if it were 51% of those who voted in this poll it would not be enough for Epic to make a change, as they could not be certain the majority of their customers wanted it - forum polls are rarely representative of customer choice.
My view about the lancer is that it is a slightly weak weapon, but it's melee/chainsaw is really powerful - so it's a trade off, like all shooters each weapon has it's pros and cons, and as players you're always having to make a choice re: which ones to use/carry.

[Gant]

Its weak. As host, you can be reasonably effective with lancer, if youre prepared to work. You work with lancer and play with the shotgun. Still the shotgun pays off more than lancer. It sucks and should be changed. A quarter of a magazine to down and half a mag at long range. Sorry to say that an endoresement of that is what makes me so skeptical about the lancer is fine posts. Just shotgun fans that dont want to get jacked by having to learn a new weapon, or take a hit in stats in ranked.

Shotgun vs three opponents charging = possible win. One shot kills with large magazine. AR is + .08 of hundreds of points of damage. Range short, and can kill or down at longer.

Lancer vs two charging = nearly certain loss. AR is + .08 of 42, swell. chainsaw not as good as melee whithout some staging. This is why the pistol is better.

Its just math and it sums up to low mid-range deterrent, which means much less use of cover, lots of open field running, simple tactics boiling down to semi coordinated rushes and lots and lots of shotgun battles.

[Gant]

You still haven't replied to the fact that the poll sits at 58% liking the Lancer the way it is.

After a couple thousand rounds of ranked play I would have to conclude its because 70 percent of players use the shotgun only or mostly. My experience playin with lots of random people, on both teams.

Think of it, responses to lancer firepower posts are use the pistol, dont play gears, use hammerburst, lancer is fine you dont know how to aim (which is funny since the pistol guys must be able to aim), you just need strategy, stop whining and etc. Not alot of dedicated Lancer users excepting the chainsaw, and shotgun users dont want the change. They like the ground rules, a weak mid range weapon, which make the shotgun the most viable and efficient option.

[ExiledWalnut]

TruPlayerz = GoW clan domination!!!

[Omega360x]

40% may be a lot, but it certainly isn't a mandate from which Epic would decide to make such a change - especially as not all purchasers of the game, or even those who play online, have voted. Even if it were 51% of those who voted in this poll it would not be enough for Epic to make a change, as they could not be certain the majority of their customers wanted it - forum polls are rarely representative of customer choice.
My view about the lancer is that it is a slightly weak weapon, but it's melee/chainsaw is really powerful - so it's a trade off, like all shooters each weapon has it's pros and cons, and as players you're always having to make a choice re: which ones to use/carry.

I can agree with that. Couldn't have explained better.

[Omega360x]

Its weak. As host, you can be reasonably effective with lancer, if youre prepared to work. You work with lancer and play with the shotgun. Still the shotgun pays off more than lancer. It sucks and should be changed. A quarter of a magazine to down and half a mag at long range. Sorry to say that an endoresement of that is what makes me so skeptical about the lancer is fine posts. Just shotgun fans that dont want to get jacked by having to learn a new weapon, or take a hit in stats in ranked.

Shotgun vs three opponents charging = possible win. One shot kills with large magazine. AR is + .08 of hundreds of points of damage. Range short, and can kill or down at longer.

Lancer vs two charging = nearly certain loss. AR is + .08 of 42, swell. chainsaw not as good as melee whithout some staging. This is why the pistol is better.

Its just math and it sums up to low mid-range deterrent, which means much less use of cover, lots of open field running, simple tactics boiling down to semi coordinated rushes and lots and lots of shotgun battles.

I don't agree with having to "work" if you wanna use the Lancer. I think it depends on your "play style". [pros] I like to take cover and shoot from there. [cons] It may take alittle longer to kill someone but thats the challenge I live for. [cons] If I wanna use the shotgun I gotta come out of cover and get up close and personal to use it, leaving me wide open for a Lancer/Sniper take down, [pros] but it only takes 1 well placed shot to kill someone.

The shotgun is more of a Halo weapon, the up-close-gun-dancing. I've said this before and I'll say it again, people still think they're playing Halo.

[Gant]

I don't agree with having to "work" if you wanna use the Lancer. I think it depends on your "play style". [pros] I like to take cover and shoot from there. [cons] It may take alittle longer to kill someone but thats the challenge I live for. [cons] If I wanna use the shotgun I gotta come out of cover and get up close and personal to use it, leaving me wide open for a Lancer/Sniper take down, [pros] but it only takes 1 well placed shot to kill someone.

The shotgun is more of a Halo weapon, the up-close-gun-dancing. I've said this before and I'll say it again, people still think they're playing Halo.

Fine not fine its the same difference. Some people like a shotgun game and theres no counter arguement to that. I think single player and coop was cool and MP is a shotgunner run and gun loser IMO. Math is math, shotgun is more useful than the lancer. After playing a lot I can tell you with certainty there is very little cover usage and no mid game deterrent. Thats all. While people like it fine, I expected better after SP and was very dissapointed by MP. Lancer is fine if you like the shotgun, its not if you dont. If the devs planed it this way then it dont matter, and if they didnt I can suggest to my hearts content. They may listen to me or others or just do it their own way but it will get changed.

[JAG30504]

umm..... have you read my post? you are probably learning disabled. in ratio, the numbers are still the same, and about 40% want the gun changed, and that is a HUGE number of people...... ive never heard of a gun in any game that gets as much sh1t as the lancer..... if i were a developer, id meet the needs of both halves and make diferent weapons, allow the host to have restrictions and make the host allow difernt start up weapons... the gameplay as described by the developers is totally misleading.

First off it still sits at 57%. Secondly if you think no weapon gets complained about like the Lancer, what about the noob weapons referred to in other games? Like the automatic shotgun in Rainbow Six Vegas, where most hosts I have played on have restricted it, not allowing it in their match. Or the auto shotty on CS? How about the main assault rifle on Killzone which made you almost invincible with its accuracy and attached grenade launcher? Or Half Life 2, the innacurracy of the sub machine gun which I constantly heard people complaining about. Or what about the pistol in Halo 2?
Every game has a gun that gets as much sh1t as the Lancer, and some games a gun has gotten even more. So your statement there is null and void.

[hoOk]

I'd like to take the time to bring back this thread for all the b*tches out there who like to hate and need to be slapped in the mouth with a flappy @#&%


LOOK IN THE NEW UPDATE, HOOK IS RIGHT, THE LANCER GOT AN UPGRADE, AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA


pwned

[k1ller91]

it is an idea if the majority of people want stronger weapons, but in two diferent game types, as where PRO mode offers stronger weapons for more advanced players, or players who hate the lancer and other guns suckiness in their power, and want a real mans game.

yea all 2gether good imagination